The Democratizing Forces of Online Universities
Blogging democratized the news industry; has the increase in online learning platforms democratized the education industry? With the proliferation of free and low-cost online educational tools, learners unlikely to attend a traditional four-year college now have greater access to education.
Free and low-cost educational platforms such as "Online Schools" now dominate the online educational market. Coursera, a platform that allows you to take classes from accredited and well-respected colleges across the nation, including Stanford, Princeton and the University of Pennsylvania, has attracted investors across the United States. TED-Ed, an educational alliance created by TEDTalks, allows users to access lectures and lessons on a variety of subjects, from the arts to science and technology. Udemy, a new startup venture, further democratizes the learning process by allowing users to post their own lesson plans. Because of the availability of user-generated content, Udemy functions more as a community skillshare than a classroom.
Online classes and non-degree educational platforms democratize the entire learning process. First, online classes and educational platforms are generally available for free, low-cost or at a rate drastically reduced from classroom learning prices. This allows a greater number of people to access information. According to a recent Seattle Times article, the cost of attending a four-year college rose by 300% from 1990-2011. This escalating cost has led to an “education bubble,” where graduating seniors are saddled with debt that they can no longer afford to pay back. The democratizing forces of online schooling allow students who are unable or unwilling to take out federal or private loans to access training without taking on exorbitant debts.
Secondly, because platforms like Udemy allow users to upload their own videos, lesson plans and PowerPoint presentations, a wider variety of information is available to interested parties. Classes in business are positioned next to classes in technology, history, mechanics and engineering. So online learning even democratizes the former hierarchical structure of subject matter that is available to college students.
Because online education is available on demand, at all hours of the day or night anywhere in the world, students who would not have had access to traditional American college campuses are engaging in exchanges of ideas. For instance, MITx, a new initiative at the Massachusetts Institute of Technology, allows a fluid exchange of ideas between MIT students and engineers of all nationalities and age ranges. Additionally, learners who work full time jobs and have families can now access educational platforms in their spare time.
According to the New York Times, online education has even democratized what students value in education. Big name professors or large, well-stocked libraries are no longer a draw for online learners. Instead, accessibility, quick response time and availability of technical support have all increased student registration and retention rates. These services can be provided by online educational platforms at a fraction of the cost of celebrity professors or rare books.
Though stalwarts of four-year colleges may consider online educational platforms secondary to a traditional college campus experience, many online learners disagree. With free or low-cost training and education available to a wide variety of learners across all age ranges and nationalities, online educational platforms have, and will continue to, democratize the educational process.
Blogging democratized the news industry; has the increase in online learning platforms democratized the education industry? With the proliferation of free and low-cost online educational tools, learners unlikely to attend a traditional four-year college now have greater access to education.
Free and low-cost educational platforms such as "Online Schools" now dominate the online educational market. Coursera, a platform that allows you to take classes from accredited and well-respected colleges across the nation, including Stanford, Princeton and the University of Pennsylvania, has attracted investors across the United States. TED-Ed, an educational alliance created by TEDTalks, allows users to access lectures and lessons on a variety of subjects, from the arts to science and technology. Udemy, a new startup venture, further democratizes the learning process by allowing users to post their own lesson plans. Because of the availability of user-generated content, Udemy functions more as a community skillshare than a classroom.
Online classes and non-degree educational platforms democratize the entire learning process. First, online classes and educational platforms are generally available for free, low-cost or at a rate drastically reduced from classroom learning prices. This allows a greater number of people to access information. According to a recent Seattle Times article, the cost of attending a four-year college rose by 300% from 1990-2011. This escalating cost has led to an “education bubble,” where graduating seniors are saddled with debt that they can no longer afford to pay back. The democratizing forces of online schooling allow students who are unable or unwilling to take out federal or private loans to access training without taking on exorbitant debts.
Secondly, because platforms like Udemy allow users to upload their own videos, lesson plans and PowerPoint presentations, a wider variety of information is available to interested parties. Classes in business are positioned next to classes in technology, history, mechanics and engineering. So online learning even democratizes the former hierarchical structure of subject matter that is available to college students.
Because online education is available on demand, at all hours of the day or night anywhere in the world, students who would not have had access to traditional American college campuses are engaging in exchanges of ideas. For instance, MITx, a new initiative at the Massachusetts Institute of Technology, allows a fluid exchange of ideas between MIT students and engineers of all nationalities and age ranges. Additionally, learners who work full time jobs and have families can now access educational platforms in their spare time.
According to the New York Times, online education has even democratized what students value in education. Big name professors or large, well-stocked libraries are no longer a draw for online learners. Instead, accessibility, quick response time and availability of technical support have all increased student registration and retention rates. These services can be provided by online educational platforms at a fraction of the cost of celebrity professors or rare books.
Though stalwarts of four-year colleges may consider online educational platforms secondary to a traditional college campus experience, many online learners disagree. With free or low-cost training and education available to a wide variety of learners across all age ranges and nationalities, online educational platforms have, and will continue to, democratize the educational process.
- Estelle Shumann
"We only truly learn when the future has become history; when we're leaping forward, turning mistakes into achievements." ~ Anonymous
I think they're a good idea. As usual our universities are ahead of our society. Whether or not you "believe" in global warming, conserving fuel and cutting down on our overcrowded highways is a no brainer.
ReplyDeleteAlso removing the social nonsense that goes along with college these days (like binge drinking, dorm rape, drug dealing, etc) doesn't require a rocket scientist to figure out that its a good idea. At least for those who's goal is to actually learn something while getting a degree.
There are many good online schools these days. One of the key things though is to make sure either its a good school that is recognized by the industry leaders in your given field or is accredited by an actual "regional" DOE recognized accrediting body.
National Accreditation is not the same thing as Regional and is not recognized by the US Dept of Education or most Regionally Accredited schools, however again depending on your goals and their recognition in the area of study you intend to pursue, they can still be perfectly acceptable.
All in all the idea of making college more accessible to wider audience , making it more affordable and at the same time cutting down on pollution and helping combat global warming (if you believe in all that sciencey junk of course) is nothing but a smart idea.
Glad to see its catching on. I might even try one one of these days if I ever find the time.
I think they're a good idea. As usual our universities are ahead of our society. Whether or not you "believe" in global warming, conserving fuel and cutting down on our overcrowded highways is a no brainer.
ReplyDeleteAlso removing the social nonsense that goes along with college these days (like binge drinking, dorm rape, drug dealing, etc) doesn't require a rocket scientist to figure out that its a good idea. At least for those who's goal is to actually learn something while getting a degree.
There are many good online schools these days. One of the key things though is to make sure either its a good school that is recognized by the industry leaders in your given field or is accredited by an actual "regional" DOE recognized accrediting body.
National Accreditation is not the same thing as Regional and is not recognized by the US Dept of Education or most Regionally Accredited schools, however again depending on your goals and their recognition in the area of study you intend to pursue, they can still be perfectly acceptable.
All in all the idea of making college more accessible to wider audience , making it more affordable and at the same time cutting down on pollution and helping combat global warming (if you believe in all that sciencey junk of course) is nothing but a smart idea.
Glad to see its catching on. I might even try one one of these days if I ever find the time.
Well,Worf,if you know JMM then you know I do not believe in absolutes.
ReplyDeleteThe statement is only half correct.....everything must have balance!Therefore we are both right.
However, there are educated folks out there who swear by this statement and they are most narrow-minded. Your examples would be labelled as "excuses" by them;an effort to avoid responsibility.
As a matter of fact entire books have been written about the subject.
This statement also goes against one of my most well liked quotes from "The Matrix"
"Choice is an illusion between those with power and those without."
Again, I was signaling the chemical precursors in your brain so as to gauge your emotional response for my study.
BTW,good answer.
I didn't say anything about absolutes. I believe my words were "of course, there's an exception to every rule", so no where did I ever say there were not times when not helping someone might help them.
ReplyDeleteBut those times are subject to an intimate knowledge of the individual in question and best made by family or friends, and even then almost invariably some alternative form of assistance is warranted and offered.
But making these into generalizations is the problem. You remove the necessary insight and declare all "unworthy" or assume your "tough love" will change their lives. It won't. Most people who need help, need help.
And as for your claims of "intelligent" people advocating these roles, you are confusing education with intelligence.
ReplyDeletePsychologists have for years proven with key predictive indicators that apathy towards the suffering of others including animals is a key indicator of lower overall intelligence as well as mental instability and potential for criminal behavior.
Again, there are "exceptions" to every rule and some people are wise enough to understand basic humanity and yet choose to be evil.
ReplyDeleteBut most are apathetic due to the inability to process empathy.
And as for people deserving their plight, again only a dull witted individual could conclude that a man who's worked 27 years at a factory got sick, lost his pension, insurance and due to medical bills can no longer meet his obligations, or who's factory closed due to plant closures and layoffs and now works at a minimum wage job because that's all that's available , is "lazy" or deserving their plight.
Again, the inability to comprehend the struggles of others is the key indicator of the lower intelligence.
Let me put it another way.
ReplyDeleteYour narrow view of capitalism requires everyone to to be a winner.
Everyone must be successful if they want a piece of the pie.
The problem however is we can't all be rocket scientists, movie stars or winning entrepreneurs. In a capitalist society where only the best and brightest are rewarded, you insure an even larger underclass that pays the price for your success by working menial labor jobs that require much harder work than most jobs the wealthier among us enjoy yet don't even pay sufficient wages to put a roof over a families head.
In your society, to be happy one must be in a high paying role.
Problem is, who's going to do the low paying roles?
The answer is obvious. The miserable.
Those who work all day yet cannot afford to put a livable roof over their families heads. And so the wife works, and that's not enough. Because twice of nothing is still nothing, and that's what anything under 40,000 per year is. Nothing. It won't even pay for a decent home.
So fine. You want a perpetually dismal underclass that suffers while the more beautiful, physically stronger or brighter succeed? Ok. So you prefer a serfdom. Fine.
But you still gotta feed them. Because remember what's happened in every serfdom in history?
That's right. Sooner or later the serfs will have had enough. And when they outnumber you, that tends to go badly for the sires.
"I didn't say anything about absolutes"
ReplyDeleteI know you didn't.
I'm just saying that over the years I have always stated...."there are no absolutes".... thus I am in agreement with you,to a point,that the statement is not entirely correct.......it holds no balance!
But as for this comment you made:
"Psychologists have for years proven with key predictive indicators that apathy towards the suffering of others is a key indicator of lower overall intelligence......."
First off, psychology is far from an exact science.
Secondly,psychology also says....
"We might wonder whether an individuals unchecked growth of love and compassion for others might lead to a reduction in his good sense of well being as the suffering of others becomes increasingly his own."
Additionally,lest you forget,many individuals with hard luck stories(don't we all have one)have little if no empathy themselves and virtually prey on those who do.
I suggest,Worf, you are confusing the right for self preservation with apathy.
First off, psychology is far from an exact science.
ReplyDeleteIn typical neoconservatism (or is the correct word these days, Tea Partism?) fashion when the science disagrees with you, then simply dismiss the science.
Never mind this has proven time and again to be an accurate predictor of both intelligence and behavior patterns since before you were born.
Just dismiss the science when it doesn't agree with you. This is how they did it in the Roman Catholic church for centuries (known as "the Dark ages") and its how everyone who allows their political ideologies override their common sense.
Additionally,lest you forget,many individuals with hard luck stories(don't we all have one)have little if no empathy themselves and virtually prey on those who do.
Again, when its easier to dismiss humanity rather than find some within yourself, in good neoconservative fashion simply make sweeping generalizations about an entire group of people so as to make it simpler to dismiss them and get a good nights sleep in doing so.
I hear you Johnny, but I don't think you hear yourself.
I suggest,Worf, you are confusing the right for self preservation with apathy.
ReplyDeleteNo, you're not reading all of my comments. I've already suggested that if one cannot find empathy with his fellow man, then at least his desire for self preservation via a continuing and productive society with low crime rates, etc is to provide for the common welfare of ones people. As history has shown us time and time again that failure to do so leads to crime, anarchy and the inevitable downfall of the upper classes and societal collapse.
So if your goal is to survive, for us to survive, then we need to find a way to if not balance the playing field, at least come up with a policy to give the losing side a few yards to move around on.
Especially when that losing side outnumbers you at about 100 to 1.
Its not enough to know history Johnny.
ReplyDeleteYou need to learn from it.
I know you're a fan of the martial arts Johnny, at least I'm sure you're a big fan of Bruce Lee movies. I know I am and we seem to have similar tastes in that area.
ReplyDeleteSo I'm sure you know the story of Jeet Kune Do and how Lee developed this fighting style.
As a young man Lee was trained in the rigid discipline of Wing Chun Kung Fu, a technique used by Shaolin nuns, that used animal stances like Crane, etc.
Lee progressed this style with his "Jun Fan Gung Fu" and finally developed his famous and unbeatable, "Jeet Kune Do". Jeet Kune do leveraged the best from all styles, which made it superior to any one or two single rigid styles.
This is the problem with "isms". Capitalism, Socialism, Communism, etc. This active condemnation of socialism assumes that anyone wants to introduce socialism, rather than simply valid principles that happen to be included in socialism.
Rather than limiting our societies to any one single ideology we should do like Lee and borrow the best from all of them. And this right wing anti socialism movement precludes that, and makes it impossible to leverage components of that because to do so is to bring the brunt of Tea Party movement down on it with their rabid anti socialism cries. Never mind that the Nazi's also were anti socialism and imprisoned and murdered tens of thousands of democratic socialists.
Conservatives today seem to have no problem adopting the tactics and ideologies like "survival of the fittest" that the Nazi's employed, but the doctrines of their enemies you'll want nothing to do with.
I do you read your posts Worf albeit a little too fast as I am busy. But, I do have company over right now and will have to rip your turban later.
ReplyDeleteBut, dont worry,you can have my old turban.....its a little dusty with a few loose threads but its better than nothing.
Gonna watch "Slumdog millionaire." Never seen it.....apparently its good???
I have not seen it, but I saw previews and I don't think you will enjoy it. I don't think I would either but then again I hate stuff like American Idol and Dancing with the Stars and I think that's what this is about.
ReplyDeleteAnytown USA. Population 6,355 if you don't count the cows.
ReplyDeleteBut the Steel Mill's been there since you were a kid. Your dad worked there and now you do to. The mill provides more than 2500 jobs to the community. Another 1500 jobs are created in peripheral support such as transportation, food service, etc. Auto dealers sell because people have jobs. Banks sell mortgages because people have jobs. The entire community is normal and stable.
Then one day a nice company like Mitt Romney's firm comes along and does a hostile take over of the firm, then flips it for the value of the assets and everyone's out of work.
Suddenly you find yourself along with 2499 other people, out of work. You have some savings and your insurance won't run out for a few months, but finding work proves more difficult than expected. Now suddenly with no business from the factory, local resaruants and businesses are laying off rather than hiring due to the decline in their own revenue. You travel further and further out looking for work but find 2400 others standing in line for the same jobs, as well as others from other firms out of work. Now your savings have run out and you're starting to fall behind on your loans and your mortgage and other obligations. You list your home but who wants to buy it in a depressed area where there's no work? So now stuck, you face either foreclosure or govt Assistance of some sort. So you opt for the govt assistance, knowing that the tax dollars you've paid into the system for so many years is finally going to pay for something for you.
Then along comes Johnny Moo Moo and the Singing Tea Party Patriots to inform you that you're a deadbeat, and are responsible for your own plight. He tells you there's no free rides in life and to go get a job.
Is this the world you really want to live in? Because its the one we've arrived in thanks to you and people like you. Is this guy really responsible for his own plight? Are the thousands of others impacted in the same way all responsible for their own lot in life? What about the guy who owns half a million in medical debt because when his wife got cancer the insurance carrier called it a pre-existing condition and dropped her? Now he owes half a million, she's dying and the bank wants him out of the house.
Did he bring this on himself? He should just snap his fingers and build a better mouse trap and make a million dollars? Is that what your "Leave it to Beaver" approach recommends? "Gee Wally...he should just buy a book on how to make a million dollars so he can pay his bills".
Like I said. Survival of the fittest was Deutschland's philosophy. And that doesn't put anyone adopting or promoting it in very good company.
OK, Worf, I noticed you comfortably ignored the following quote from one of my psychology books which throws a wrench in your thesis that I must burden myself and sacrifice my own difficulties, every-time I run into an individual with a hard luck story.
ReplyDelete"We might wonder whether an individuals unchecked growth of love and compassion for others might lead to a reduction in his good sense of well -being as the suffering of others becomes increasingly his own."
“I am not what has happened to me,
ReplyDeleteI am what I choose to become.”
I’ve already stated that this statement is only half correct thus I am in partial agreement with you that sometimes the path we choose in life is not entirely dictated by the choices we make.......other peoples actions can and do affect us greatly.
Nevertheless,two people suffering the same fate can take different trails……thus choice!
For example, one may drown him/herself with drugs or alcohol and milk the scenario in an effort to get pity from those with bleeding hearts while the other may triple his efforts to overcome his plight and eventually get back on his feet again.
I certainly feel for the guy who lost his job of twenty seven years, but I do know that I myself made a choice to keep a healthy security fund around for unexpected dilemma’s as I am fully aware that life offers many conundrum’s.
If he and other people chose not to put a little away each week then they must accept responsibility for their own actions on this level.
It is you who is making sweeping generalizations as if lazy people almost do not exist and are few and far between. And, your cherry –picked stories of plant closures.
ReplyDeleteI am not being theatrical when I say that if I go downtown I am virtually harassed for smokes and change by scum who simply loathe work and would prefer to live off the industrious efforts of others.
One guy even blocked my path and attempted to touch me causing me to holler:
“Don’t f*cking touch me.”
I gave him a smoke but when he noticed I had a full pack he instantly blurted: “Oh, Wow, look how many you have! Give me some more!”
Sorry, I am simply unable to supply half the ant-farm from my meager bank account of which I struggled laboriously to achieve.
On another occasion, as I gave change and smokes to one guy, another across the street noticed and he literally darted across the lane-ways, through traffic, to get his booty from what he felt was “a live one.”
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FwP2vV6Wm1Y&list=FLKzxDSzozwgMWG7JPQzr66g&index=42&feature=plpp_video
When he reached me I said....
”Awww......C’mon buddy give me a break!”
Now if I knew for sure that the bum outside the liquor store really needed to “eat a decent meal” I wouldn’t have given him the change from my pocket, I would have purchased him an entire dinner.
You see, Worf, for every thesis there is an antithesis.....PERIOD!
ReplyDeleteSo when Lydia says love is the answer or you say we must carry other people’s burdens so as to avoid being psychopaths then I know automatically there is an antithesis at play.
And, let’s face it, I don’t exactly see you or Lydia selling your houses so you may take the proceeds to save some of the thousands of children who die each month from starvation???
Are their young lives not worth your fancy mortgages or are you two a little apathetic?
Vagaries of perception Worf…………vagaries of perception!
Where you would like me to send that used turban coz yours just got ripped……….big time?
ReplyDelete:D
However, your Bruce Lee analogy regarding a mixture of ideologies is certainly a thinker?
How did you know I was a big fan of Bruce Lee and his movies? I don’t recall discussing it with you?
ReplyDeleteI idolized him as a younger whipper-snapper! I am also an excellent chess player.
ReplyDelete"We might wonder whether an individuals unchecked growth of love and compassion for others might lead to a reduction in his good sense of well -being as the suffering of others becomes increasingly his own."
I didn't realize you were "suffering" so badly while going to the movies with friends.
Nor did I realize you were now financially struggling because you've given so very much of your wealth to the poor.
You are to be commended.
Nevertheless,two people suffering the same fate can take different trails……thus choice!
ReplyDeleteThis is the sort of "pull yourself up by your bootstraps" nonsense that I'm talking about.
Sure. We all know that we can make choices. But what happens when those choices don't exist?
When you're a middle aged man with a wife and kids living in a rural community and locked into a mortgage on a home that isn't worth what you owe on it, and Bain Capitol just came in and shut down the the factory that's been providing jobs to the ENTIRE COMMUNITY for over 20 years, ...what "choice" do you think they have?
3000 people just lost their jobs.
What they're all supposed to go out and invent a better mouse trap?
Just "think positive" and magically jobs will appear?
This sort of positive mental attitude stuff only carries you so far. Then reality sets in.
So no, its not always about choice.
People don't choose to get cancer, or hurt on the job. People don't choose for companies like Bain capitol to come in and destroy an entire communities livelihood.
And people cannot always choose a direction out when there ARE NO OPTIONS left, other than bankruptcy and failure.
That's why we as a society need to be bigger than that and provide help for our people, or as the Constitution of the United States of America says "Provide for the General Welfare" of our people.
If he and other people chose not to put a little away each week then they must accept responsibility for their own actions on this level.
ReplyDeleteSo now you too "conveniently" ignored the part that points out that he did have savings. MOST people have savings.
You also conveniently missed the part where the savings "ran out".
See, I realize there in Canada you don't understand what happens to people here in the United States when illness comes into a family, but "savings" and "putting a little away each week" is BULLSHIT.
Just a line of bullshit that "sounds" good, but wouldn't even put a DENT in US Health Care costs.
My friend for example, who makes over 100k, has a wife, 3 kids and a good steady job. He saves as does MOST people. And he had health care coverage from his good job.
But when his 4 year old daughter was diagnosed with BONE CANCER, and they had to amputate the leg.
Then the doctors had to amputate her left leg. So they took it off just above the knee. At 4 years old.
Then the medical bills started coming in. Soon the bills had reached as high as HALF A MILLION DOLLARS.
Then came the letter from his insurance company, informing him they had determined that the bone cancer was a "preexisting condition".
So they dropped her from the coverage.
Like most good hard working families here in the US, this friend of mine had some savings. More than most probably being he was a young man in his early 40s.
He cashed out his IRA, pulled money out of the bank but it didn't even make a dent in the piling up medical bills.
Now the little girl needed a new prosthetic limb, because she was growing and it had to be replaced every few months. He couldn't afford it. His wife got a job on the side, but still couldn't even come CLOSE to the bills required.
Well this friend of mine ended up going on the internet having to literally "beg" strangers for money. His daughter became known online as whats called a "Wednesdays Child" and he was able to help his daughter a bit.
But he's still crushed under the debt. Bill collectors call non stop. He ultimately had to file bankruptcy on these debts, just because NO working man can come up with MILLIONS to cover such ludicrous debt.
That's just ONE example of thousands of similar ones. That one is true however, and it happened to a friend of mine.
But that's just one example. Your "pick yourself up by your bootstraps" bullshit, only goes so far.
Sure, for single carefree schmucks like you and me perhaps we can always find another route.
But for men raising families, kids, ...who confront the very real and frequent issues out there with plant closures, lay offs, illness, etc there are not always choices.
Not reasonable ones anyway.
It is you who is making sweeping generalizations as if lazy people almost do not exist and are few and far between. And, your cherry –picked stories of plant closures.
ReplyDeleteCherry picked? Uhh, I live in a community where JUST such a "generalization" took place.
In fact the state in which I live and the adjoining state has hundreds of such "generalizations".
I know it helps you conservative types sleep a little better at night to pretend its all just generalizations, but the fact is this is happening in towns and cities across the United States.
These are realities, whether your conservative blinders allow you to see them or not.
ReplyDeleteI gave him a smoke but when he noticed I had a full pack he instantly blurted: “Oh, Wow, look how many you have! Give me some more!”
Speaking of choices, isn't it fortunate for you that you live in a country that will take care of you when the choice you made to give yourself emphysema and lung cancer finally catches up to you?
You choose to smoke, because you know you'll be cared for when it eventually catches up with you.
Isn't it fortunate that while you promote right wing "every man for himself" tea party dogma, ...that you yourself will never have to worry about such things being as you live in a country that will provide for you when your own "choice" to smoke finally catches up with you.
Oh I'm sure you'll tell me how you have insurance (don't know too many insurance companies that will insure a smoker against the results of smoking), and work hard, blah blah blah.
We all work hard Johnny.
But unlike you, those here in the united states don't have the luxury of a state paid insurance program.
And you know why?
Because people like you, conservatives, are busy telling us why we don't deserve one.
ReplyDeleteAnd, let’s face it, I don’t exactly see you or Lydia selling your houses so you may take the proceeds to save some of the thousands of children who die each month from starvation???
Are their young lives not worth your fancy mortgages or are you two a little apathetic?
Uhh, what makes you think I or Lydia could sell our houses in a depressed housing market for even what we owe on them, much less for some sort of magical windfall?
I know my house isn't worth what I paid for it years ago, so how exactly it would help the poor for me to sell my home at a loss eludes me.
As it apparently eludes you.
Of course in typical right wing fashion, you fall back to the tired one liners and staples of your bullshit.
Rather than address the NATIONAL efforts needed to combat poverty and provide assistance to the middle class, you instead chose to lay the burden on the shoulders of anyone speaking up for those in need.
That's easier than voting for change.
Just say "why don't you help them" to anyone advocating help for people, and then walk away feeling yourself better for having avoiding any accountability for your own social apathy.
ReplyDeleteHow did you know I was a big fan of Bruce Lee and his movies? I don’t recall discussing it with you?
I told you, I didn't. I just assumed you did, since we seem to have such similar interests.
I know you apparently, better than you think.
See Johnny, the tired old "you do something for the poor if you want to so bad" line is infantile argument that's used by those working against social stability, i.e conservatives.
ReplyDeleteIts like when some billionaires like Warren Buffet pointed out there tax rates were too low compared to the working class.
Rather than address that glaring fact staring them in the face, republican senators said like you do, "well, if you feel that way then feel free to pay more".
As if THAT would do anything to resolve the problem.
Just like your giving a buck to a bum at the movie theater isn't going to change anything either.
Its the neoconservative MENTALITY on a NATIONAL and GLOBAL level that needs to change.
A handful of wealthy individuals voluntarily paying more in taxes won't change the deficit one iota.
And people choosing to give their charitable farthings here and there when they "feel so inclined" won't change anything either.
Until we start voting on a national level to do something about the poor and middle class to help raise the bar and make for a better life for all, then nothing's going to change.
Its not one individual doing something. Its ALL of us doing something on a large scale that will make the difference.
Programs to help the poor, as well as the working middle class are fought by your sort each day in the halls of government and thus they are "half funded" and then of course never achieve their goals.
Programs like Social Security, Medicare, Unemployment, etc take up a small part of our national annual budget, but we funnel money away from them to pay for wars in foreign countries that serve no purpose.
So the tired old republican cop out "you do something" is just that. A cop out.
Its not even an adult argument. Its infantile.
It ignores the problem and merely serves to place the onus for societies woes on the heads of those seeking to address them, and helps the apathetic clods who embrace them sleep a little better at night.
Like the Tao of Jeet Kune Do, we as a people need to cast off the tired old stringent and static movements of the "animal styles" and embrace a more holistic and all encompassing approach to combating poverty and the struggles of the middle classes.
ReplyDeleteLike Bruce Lee, we can borrow from these styles key elements which work, and abandon those that do not.
Rather than hold fasting to our tiny, narrow minded views such as conservatism, or liberalism, we need to expand our style to embrace all styles to come up with our own.
From Socialism we learn that as long as there is a bottom class that has no hope of hearth or home, or daily bread, then there will be crime.
From Capitalism we learn that rewarding hard work and resourcefulness encourages growth and development.
From Communism we learn that working together as a people towards national goals can move us ahead faster than individualism.
There are traits we can learn from most social orders that can benefit us. We take what is good from them and discard the rest. And that's who we need to become if we're going to survive on this planet.
We need to develop our own "Gung Fu" and put an end to all this rigidity that's caused us to founder for so very long.
“So they dropped her from the coverage”
ReplyDeleteThis infuriates me!!!
Such greed and apathy for this particular scenario simply boggles my mind!
My heart genuinely goes out to your friend and his wee one.....I would be willing to contribute a bit and would suggest that Lydia does the same.
I could send Lydia a $100.00 check and she could forward it to you along with hers? Let me know? But, the money has to go towards medical bills and would accept your personal word it would.
I must point out that I have always supported Obama-care.
And, I am very pleased that we at least agree on the fact that sometimes ,not all the time, but sometimes the path we choose in life is not entirely dictated by the choices we make.......other peoples actions can and do affect us greatly......very important!
My heart genuinely goes out to your friend and his wee one.....I would be willing to contribute a bit and would suggest that Lydia does the same.
ReplyDeleteI could send Lydia a $100.00 check and she could forward it to you along with hers? Let me know? But, the money has to go towards medical bills and would accept your personal word it would.
Thanks, but that happened back in 2000 and she's grown now.
Fortunately enough people donated on the website for "Wednesdays Child" to help her get those prosthetic legs she needed to grow and develop normally.
But there's a thousand stories like that where they didn't get what they needed.
Black kids don't fare as well on those sites as do pretty little white girls like this one, nor do other ethnicity's. Which is part of the American culture of course.
The important thing here is that sort of thing goes on every day. Its not something that is "unique".
Helping one kid won't change the problem. Although helping one kid is still a good thing, and that's nice of you to offer 100 bucks like that. That's a generous donation, particularly if you're as poor as you keep whining about, lol.
I must point out that I have always supported Obama-care
ReplyDeleteReally?
I wasn't aware of that. You'll have to direct to me to your comments promoting that, as up until now they've eluded me.
But I am glad to hear it.
ReplyDeleteThat is very encouraging.
Of course, if you really wanted to "support" it, you might start with not referring to it as "Obamacare".
After all, using a intended derogatory term invented by republicans to fight against it doesn't exactly bode well for your intent on promoting it.
ReplyDelete"National Health Care" coverage is something you enjoy, as does most of Europe and South America.
"Obamacare" is simply a word used to fight against it here in the states.
But I am glad to see you understand that for a society to prosper, it needs to ensure that even its lowest, most "undeserving" citizen deserves proper medical treatment when they are hurt or injured.
ReplyDeleteThat is the cornerstone of a developed and enlightened society.
Unfortunately for the United States, the big insurance companies were able to convince the republican half of our country went out and protest against giving ourselves national health care coverage.
So what we got, was nothing but the same crappy old insurance we've had all along.
The insurance that drops us, as soon as we get really sick.
Of course, I guess it's lucky for the insurance companies, that they could find people dumb enough to go out and vote against giving themselves national health care coverage.
Unfortunately for the rest of us however, we have to suffer for the stupidity of the lowest common denominators.
ReplyDeleteOf which there are many.
So instead of national health care coverage (via the public option of extending medicare to everyone who wants or needs it) we get to get sick, get dropped by our insurance companies, then get denied treatment or get it, and get hounded by bill collectors until we file bankruptcy. And they've even found ways around that.
Did you know that in the US now, insurance companies have people working in Emergency rooms POSING as health care workers, who try to talk the under insured out of getting treatment?
They actually turn people away for not having enough coverage. Even those that do get turned away.
Did you know we dump the uninsured off on the streets, IV's still attached to their arms?
That's right.
Hospital workers stuff them into Taxi cabs and say "Get them out of here".
Then the Taxi just dumps them off on the street, still wearing their hospital gowns, IV needles still stuck in their arms.
Happens all the time.
This country is fighting against itself, and has since the American Civil War.
There is one side of this country, the darker, dumber side, that has nothing but apathy for their fellow man.
In the 1800's, that side felt that black people ought to be "OWNED" by them, to work in their fields for little to no wages.
So the better half, the "human" half, had to kick their asses back into the stone age until they woke up.
And we did.
We opened a huge can of "whoop-ass" on these cretins, and they surrendered.
But not after first assassinating our leader in a cowardly act of revenge.
Today this same crowd still exists. Their descendants still fly the Southern Cross, still talk of civil war and treason if they don't get their way.
Of course unlike their ancestors, they either have the good sense not to try it again, or haven't the balls to do so.
Either way if they did, we'd open another can of whoopass on them until they once more crawl back into their holes.
And those people aside, which unfortunately represents a large demographic in our country, the rest of us need to come together to make things work. Republicans and democrats who are not lost in partisan hatred need to come together to find common ground.
ReplyDeleteThis doesn't mean the republicans who think "govt doesn't work" so they do whatever they can to destroy it and make it not work, just to prove a point. Those types are in the afore mentioned group.
But the reasonable ones, the ones who want to see the US thrive as a nation and who can get past the partisan rhetoric to focus on solutions, rather than problems.
Right now the GOP has stated its goals. Their goals are not to make things work, help Americans or improve the country.
Their stated goals are to drive President Obama from office, even if they have to tear down the country and drag it into ruin to accomplish that.
We need people who are better than this.
We need decent, honest hard working people determined to make it work. Who understand compromise is not some "language of the devil", but a reality required in this world if we're all going to live here together.
At times I think you could be such a person. A thought especially encouraged by your latest revelation that you support national health care coverage.
But its hard to tell.
First off,
ReplyDeleteIs a man NOT entitled to the fruits of his own labor?
And if he should voluntarily give out of his fortune generous?
Just who is anyone else (like you) to demand he give the fruits of his labor to anyone?
And when you have the audacity to use the police powers of government to confiscate the fruits of his labor then you yourselves claim the credit of being generous and benevolent?
Especially when Johnny notes that you will not give up YOUR comforts for the cause? What, because you wouldn't get much for your property? It's not enough to help?
Was the old woman who gave everything she had turned away because it wasn't enough?
Your heart bleeds for this cause and while you're willing to condone forcibly taking everyone else's wealth, what you have is just too small?
Especially when you often brag you make six figures???
I think that's called white liberal guilt...
ReplyDeleteAnd regarding Bain Capital, their objective was to save failing companies.
ReplyDeleteSure, some workers may have lost their jobs in the restructuring and that sucks.
But what about the ones that got to keep theirs?
Would it have turned out better if the company just went tits up and EVERYONE lost their jobs?
And in the rare instances when the company couldn't be saved and was parted out, those people would've lost their jobs anyway.
It's also pretty hard to just pack up a factory and move it away. Whoever bought the subsidiaries more than likely hired some of these people back. Probably not at the same wages they were making, but that's probably part of what was killing the company in the first place.
You talk about not believing in absolutes, but your way seems to be all or nothing...
ReplyDeleteDamn Bain Capital when they saved more jobs than they lost.
Why should anyone work when everyone can't?
Capitalism isn't perfect, but it creates the best conditions for the largest majority.
ReplyDeleteOften overlooked is the fact that the poor in this country are much, much better off than the poor in any other one.
Most of our "poor" have large screen televisions and two cars.
Thank you Capitalism.
Sooner or later I knew you'd be taking over for Johnny. Particularly have he endorsed national health care.
ReplyDeleteAnd no, that's another white ring lie. No ones demanding you give anything. But you do have to pay taxes.
Once you pay your tax dollars over, social programs and such are determined in congress. They decide where the money goes. You pay taxes regardless of where it goes.
Should you have a voice in where its spent? Sure. You do, with your votes.
And like the good Christian you are, you're in here complaining about any of it, even the small fractions of what we spend on our overall budget being spent on the poor, but for some reason have no problem with spending the bulk of it on wars and giving large corporations tax breaks.
I get it.
As for white liberal guilt, that's a load of crap as well. A I'm not a liberal, and B you ignored everything I wrote about how we all enjoy a better society when no ones left out.
And I won't make those arguments again. Because in good troll fashion, you jump in to dismiss everything I wrote and every argument with a few grand old party one liners.
People like you and your tightfisted stingy "me me me" doctrines are the problem with our country. You keep dragging us all down to your selfish, frightened level with your fear of everything from the poor to terrorists.
Especially when Johnny notes that you will not give up YOUR comforts for the cause? What, because you wouldn't get much for your property? It's not enough to help?
ReplyDeleteWas the old woman who gave everything she had turned away because it wasn't enough?
Again with stupid garbage like this, where you just pop in and remake an argument that's already been dismantled and dismissed, well, I just can't do this anymore.
You aren't really here to talk. You're hear to use deception, misdirection, lies and distortions rather than simply discuss or even debate.
I already pointed out that I couldn't sell my home if I wanted to. Its not worth what I paid for it so how could I sell it?
And what good would I do the world, or my family by throwing us all out in the street even if I could?
And ALL of that, is moot.
Because I already addressed that stupid "infantile" argument for what it is.
This is not about one person here and there offering to give of themselves. I give plenty to charities but it doesn't make a dent.
What needs to change is on a national level. The REAL dents made in poverty can come from how we use our budget.
People like you say "screw the poor", in good "Mister Potter" fashion.
And its people like you that have said that since the dawn of man , and are why there are still poor.
Throwing them the crumbs off your plate won't do it. We need to as a people be for helping our own, and as our constitution states, "Provide for the General Welfare" of the people.
If we can't do that, what's the good of even having a country.
And as for "Capitalism", again you're doing what you always do.
ReplyDeleteIgnoring EVERYTHING I wrote, so I'll have to write it over again if I choose to respond to your infantile nonsense.
Try reading what I wrote on capitalism a few paragraphs up. Or don't. Because I can't do this anymore with you. Really I can't.
Johnny's ok, at least he wants to honestly talk and discuss.
But you want nothing more than to fill this blog with your lies, nonsense and right wing talking points while driving off even people like me, by consistently ignoring everything I write while still attacking it, so I have to keep writing the same things over and over until you finally acknowledge them a day or too later.
I've had my fill of that. Perhaps others have not.
I'm glad everything worked out for your friend Worf and I'm shocked by your description of health care down there.......almost unbelievable!
ReplyDeleteI couldn't even comprehend going to the hospital after becoming sick or injured and then being handed a bill for 50,000 smackers.......I would faint!
Seems almost barbaric and not even real.
I am firm that national health care is a good thing for all and a step in the right direction in building a more humane state.But,I thought the word "Obamacare was American terminology in general.....LOL!
BTW,my dad bought another house down in Saginaw and I'm still in disbelief at the house prices down there.....almost a joke!Kinda makes me feel bad for what used to be the most richest and powerful nation on the planet.
Oh,oh,Volts back and he never fails to bring out the conservative in JMM.........LOL!
ReplyDeleteI'm glad everything worked out for your friend Worf
ReplyDeleteI wouldn't call a grown man earning over 100,000 per year with medical insurance having to go on the internet to beg from strangers so his daughter could walk, "everything working out" but yes, his daughter did end up getting the artificial limbs she needed during her growing years which was important because if the child learns to walk with them at an early age it becomes second nature to them and their stride is more natural.
But I'm glad you agree that public health care is a cornerstone of any good and decent government, and the hallmark of an enlightened society.
Such as the one you live in.
As for house prices, you say you live in Canada right?
ReplyDeleteI've been pricing property in Canada, Alberta, BC, etc, and they're no different that I can see. In fact they're outrageous, lol.
I mean, look at this. This 5 bedroom, 4 bath is half a million dollars! lol
ReplyDeletehttp://homes.point2.com/CA/Ontario/Ottawa/1159585865-Real-Estate.aspx
I can't believe that. Its wedged right in between two other homes. No land. But they want a cool half mil.
And I'm seeing those sort of prices everywhere I look. This is way worse than the US. Right now the homes here are undervalued. Everyone's upside down on them.
Canada's outrageous! LOL
Are you sure you live in Canada?
"Are you sure you live in Canada?"
ReplyDeleteYou know very well I do.
My dad bought his first house in Saginaw for around 17,000 and the second for around 14,000 I believe.....he even hired some young male Americans to help him out! The same houses up here would go for around 250,000 to 300,00.......no joke!
Your right,prices are simply outrageous up here but I am an expert at locating a bargain. I fix it up and sell it later at a mean profit.
Right now I have 100 x 50 feet of beautiful back yard with a small workshop and even raspberry bushes......nice trees as well and very quiet!
Immaculate hardwood floors and plush red carpeting but the house does need some work.......the bathroom certainly sucks!
Ive done much already and will post some pics when I get a chance.
100 x 50 is about the size of my detached garage.
ReplyDeleteQuiet is good, but I need a little more elbow room though.
Sounds nice though. Sounds like you got a good deal.
"100 x 50 is about the size of my detached garage"
ReplyDeleteMan,you must be rich! Hey, do you think you could lend me a couple of mil? I'm kinda short right now after giving you that twenty tril.
Money is my God. You don't need love when you have lotsa money.
Trust me......it does buy happiness! Poor people say it doesn't in an attempt to make themselves feel good.
Not even close. Having a large garage doesn't mean you're rich. Here in the states you can get more for your money I think if you hunt for bargains like we both do.
ReplyDeleteI'm far from rich. If I were rich I wouldn't have to work every day.
I'm so poor I can't pay attention.
I always liked Zombie movies (bet you do to).
ReplyDeleteI never thought it would actually happen though.
http://news.yahoo.com/witness-says-naked-attacker-chewing-mans-face-162408953.html
Note the cop shot him and he kept on eating. He shot him a second time to put him down (in the head?).
ReplyDeleteLooks like we got "walkers" in Florida.
If it is zombies, then don't do like they do in the movies and barricade yourself in some place that they can get into.
ReplyDeleteGo up high, like in a high rise office building, then either take out the stairs for a few floors or cement them up. Use the elevator shafts to cover those few floors via a rope ladder or a some sort of jumar you rig up that you can lower and then pull up behind you and you could stay there as long as you had water.
Most big buildings have giant boilers full of water so that's easy. And you can collect rain water on the roof. Also plant a roof garden. It'll get lots of sun.
You can sit on the roof and pick off zombies for fun like they did in Dawn of the Dead (remake). You could also get lots of them together and push some heavy crap down on them. From 20 or 30 stories up a desk makes a pretty big hole. Especially in a bunch of zombies.
As you can see, I've really thought this out.
I am ready for World War Z.
ReplyDelete..as soon as it comes out on DVD.
http://youtu.be/GZ9e3Dy7obA
WWLEE
"Note the cop shot him and he kept on eating."
ReplyDeleteHope it wasn't that bum outside the liquor store who apparently needed to eat a decent meal.....LOL??!!
Bizarre indeed!
“As you can see, I've really thought this out.”
ReplyDeleteYes, sounds like a lot of fun. If we worked together I could shimmy down the elevator shaft and proceed outside after which you could use an AR-15 with scope to provide covering fire support from the rooftop while I blow Zombies away at close range with my .44 Desert Eagle and automatic shotgun.....of course you would have to have plenty of spare clips handy!
AR14? Well, I sort of saw myself with a BAR on a bipod wedged in one of the upstairs window like one of the guys on Kelly's Heroes. But yes, Ammo is always going to be an issue issue.
ReplyDeleteHence my "Drop'n'Stop" strategy.
It still involves you rappelling down to the first floor via the elevator shaft, however this strategy involves you going over to the windows and tapping on them. Sort of like they did in the First Dawn of the Dead (the 70s version) in the mall that time.
Just tap on the window and make funny faces or something. Just make yourself look appetizing.
This will draw a bunch of zombies over to the window. When enough of them have gathered, I'll push a desk out of the 25th floor window onto their heads.
Figure an average 30 story office building with about about 100 desks per floor and assuming roughly 10 zombies per desk, we'd be looking at something like 30,000 zombies wiped out using this method.
ReplyDeleteAnd that doesn't even factor in conference tables, TV sets or those big potted plants.
"Just tap on the window and make funny faces or something. Just make yourself look appetizing.
ReplyDeleteThis will draw a bunch of zombies over to the window. When enough of them have gathered, I'll push a desk out of the 25th floor window onto their heads."
LOL......sounds good not to mention it will conserve on ammo!!
:D
But,what if one of the zombies was Lydia??? Would you still have the guts to push the deck and flatten her like a pancake???
Keep in mind,shes not human anymore!!
All Zombies are automatic pancakes in my eyes. Even you if you get bit and turn.
ReplyDeleteAnd I'd expect you to relieve me of my cranium were I to turn, as I don't want to be walking around like that. When I'm dead, that's it. No flesh eating zombie life for me.
A zombie is a zombie and automatically subject to being made into a pancake should they come within range of one of my desks.
"All Zombies are automatic pancakes in my eyes. Even you if you get bit and turn."
ReplyDeleteGood!You are a true soldier Worf and I'm sure we would make a good team.
However, were I to be bitten, I was kinda hoping you would shed a tear before you flatten me??
:)
You know, just like in the movies. Your supposed to shout.....
ReplyDelete"I cant do it. I cant do it."
........before you flatten me.
Immediately thereafter you sit in some far off distant corner and shed a few tears???
Oh not just a tear for my good friend. No sir. Nothing less than one of my farewell limerick's will do.
ReplyDeleteFarewell my friend, farewell and hail,
ReplyDeleteI'll no more hear your zombie's wail
In this task I dare not fail
Cuz you're a zombie all dead and pale.
So now we must just say goodbye
please turn your head to yonder sky
don't close your eyes just look ahead
don't hold your breath you'll soon be dead
from the desk I'm dropping on your head.
..Twiddle widdle, ..toodle loo...
ReplyDeleteall I want is to stay with you
But a desk landed on your head, so
..guess we're through.
Bummer,I forgot to pay my wireless,pay as you go stick.
ReplyDeleteAnyways, thanks for the little bit of empathy regarding my flattening Worf........I,ll fall into a deep sleep with a smile on my face tonight.
Finally got around to watching that Bruce Lee clip……..far from his best fight scenes! I love it when he rips Chuck Norris’s turban in “Return of the Dragon.” Now that’s a good fight!
ReplyDeleteI got busted in high school for keeping these in my locker………
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bv9uFxYhp3c&feature=related
someone ratted me out......LOL!
Never even heard of WWZ until you mentioned it. Just watched the trailer.....looks pretty good!
Return of the Dragon? That cheap knock off where they piece together clips of him and some fake they found that barely looks like him?
ReplyDeleteYou dare compare the great "Enter the Dragon", the king of all kung fu movies with that cheap piece of crap that they made to capitalize on his death?
"Bullsh$t Mister Hahn Man.....you come straight out of a comic book!"
Lee's fight scene in the tunnels where he takes on all the guards and smacks the snot out of them with the two sticks has always been one of his great ones.
ReplyDeleteAlthough some argue the scenes from "The Big Boss" and Fists of Fury are far superior.
Chuck Norris however isn't even in the ballpark but I did like watching him get the snot kicked out of him, lol.
The Chinese Connection was also great.
ReplyDeleteI saw the originals at an all day kung fu matinee at the local theater back in the 70s.
I also saw all 5 of the planet of the apes movies on "Go Ape" day at the same theater.
When I came out of the theater on Kung Fu day I was kicking all the street signs.
When I came out of the theater on "go ape" day I was walking like a monkey.
"Return of the Dragon? That cheap knock off where they piece together clips of him and some fake they found that barely looks like him?"
ReplyDeleteYou are woefully mistaken Agent Smith.....I don't even have to Google to know that.
The movie your thinking of was "Game of Death" and they used old clips from previous movies including "Return of the Dragon."
BTW,I read his biography decades ago and Bruce's wife, Linda, said that Bruce would have given "anything for one real friend."
At the time I thought this very odd?
"When I came out of the theater on "go ape" day I was walking like a monkey."
ReplyDeleteYour weird........LOL!!
You're right, I was thinking of Game of Death, (the one where Kareem Abdul Jabar is in that underfitted gi,) where they have to go through all the levels I think.
ReplyDeleteBut what threw me, was your calling "Way of the Dragon", "Return of the Dragon".
Its actually "Way of the Dragon".
Its the one Lee directed himself and I think I've only seen it once. I did not see it when it came out. All I saw was Chinese Connection, the Big Boss, Fists of Fury and Enter the Dragon. And of course Game of Death which was a real bummer.
I think I saw Way of the Dragon on ppv or something once. I'll have to check it out again.
Your weird........LOL!!
ReplyDeleteHey, you try 8 straight hours of Planet of the Apes movies. It'll drive you ...ape. When I came out I just naturally started swaying. I was clearly devolving back to an earlier primate form.
"In the words of our great lawgiver.....I never met an ape...I didn't like."
This video is for Lydia.
ReplyDeletePerhaps she might want to consider teaming with this guy next time she goes to Vegas?
And I completely agree with him regarding walkers........LOL!
:D
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=muFxayEXjC0
ReplyDelete:D
Lydia
ReplyDeleteI have to be painfully honest with you........your LCPH pic sucks.......you kinda look like a bug!
However, in this pic you look sophisticated and even.....choke..... somewhat intelligent........not to mention your boobs aren't hanging out.
May I suggest you change your pic to this one.
http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=214314538598514&set=a.214314431931858.69736.214218185274816&type=1&theater
Hey heard about that shooting in the Toronto mall there Johnny. That sucks. Sounds like the cops got him though before he did too much damage.
ReplyDeleteActually,my mom told me about it last night when few details were available.....the police didn't even know who the shooter was!
ReplyDeleteBTW,I just bought a Bushnell 6" reflector telescope.......super cool!
I cant wait to use it for the first time on a clear night. Even on its lowest power the instructions say that you can easily see the rings of Saturn and its moons. I'm looking forward to checking out the bands of Jupiter,the mountains of our moon and the Andromeda galaxy.
Why is there something rather than nothing???And what if our universe was just a mere grain of sand on a beach?
One thing for sure we know the universe is not infinite. If it were then it couldn't have had a beginning.
Congratulations Luke.
ReplyDeleteYou've just taken your first step into a larger world.
"a Bushnell 6" reflector telescope"
ReplyDelete...this is the weapon of a Jedi Knight....your father's "lightsaber".
: |
...a elegant weapon from a more civilized age.
Not to put a damper on your nocturnal gazing activities (remember your eyes have to be open to use that thing), but your choice of lightsabers was not optimal if its near earth objects you're looking to gaze at.
ReplyDeleteWhat you bought is called a "Newtonian", (as in after the design of Sir Issac Newton).
A Newtonian reflector is designed for "deep space" viewing such as distant stars, nebula, etc.
For near earth objects like the planets or the moon, a Refractor telescope (like Galileo used) is the preferred type of scope.
The reflector gives a wider view or "rich field" view where as a refractor provides a smaller more concentrated view. So to sight in the planets, the moon, etc you're going to get a better experience with a refractor.
Also from a maintenance perspective a refractor is better for the fledgling astronomer because it doesn't require the maintenance.
A reflector has to be constantly aligned and tweaked. Those mirrors have to line up just right. Also being an open design a reflector is prone to frequent condensation and fogging build up on the lens and mirrors, which will mar your views dramatically. A refractor is closed, and doesn't have those issues. You just take it out, set it up and start gazing.
So if you do get discouraged, I suggest before giving up try a refractor. You'll not be disappointed. Even a cheap 70 or 80 mm refractor will give you great views of the moon. On the planets you can also see Jupiter and the moons with one, although the divisions in the planets gas storms are limited and the moons just look like little diamonds. Saturn's rings are disappointing on a smaller refractor too. But the moon is awesome. You can see right into the craters.
I have an Orion 120mm refractor, which is a very large refractor (and cost effective) and gives incredible, magazine photograph quality views of Saturn and its rings and divisions in the rings. All the planets look good through it. The Moon is like walking on it with this one. But like I said, you don't need one this big. A good 80 or 90 mil will suffice. The important thing is get a good focal length (like 900 or 1000) and get yourself a "Barlow lens", (which increases the magnification). You won't be sorry.
Now, that's just some good advice from a fellow stargazer.
But that being said, don't let that discourage you. You can see great views of the moon and the planets from a reflector if you have the right conditions. It must be very dark sky, no city lights and you have to have low condensation (or keep the lenses clean). I assume you got a 4.5 inch scope, which is your standard starter reflector. Bushnell is more for terrestrial scopes but they do make good lenses so it should be a good scope.
I'd take it out on a dark night and start with the moon. The moon will be easiest to track in. Here's a tip though for sighting it in.
I assume this scope came with a good equatorial mount with hand controls (the little wheels on a cable). Mount your tripod (equatorial mount) firmly in the ground. Place a heavy object on the center tray for stability if its wobbly. Then, when tracking in the moon don't place your eye on the lens. Instead, pull back and look at the lens from a few inches away. Look for a bright light in the lens as you sight in the moon. When you see the bright light like a diamond coming though the lens, then put your eye in closer and track it in. Try not to touch your eye to the lens though. Keep it lightly just above it.
With a 4.5 inch reflector, if you get it sighted in you should get some pretty impressive views of the moon. Jupiter as well. Saturn won't be as impressive as you might want (a orange BB with a little ring around it) but you'll still see it although tracking it in will be hard.
And remember these objects will be moving (we are and so are they) so you'll need to constantly adjust to keep them in your field of view.
ReplyDeleteBut you did a wise thing getting a scope, and its a great evening activity you'll get years of pleasure from.
If you ever do decide you'd like to try a refractor scope and spend some more of that hard earned money of yours, then try this website.
http://www.telescope.com/
This is "Orion Telescope" and they are one of the best telescope manufacturers out there, particularly for celestial scopes (space as opposed to earth viewing).
Orion is a family owned business out in California and they grind their own lenses so they're able to offer very high quality lenses and scopes for incredible prices.
This is similar to the scope I have.
http://www.telescope.com/Telescopes/Refractor-Telescopes/Refractor-Telescopes-with-Equatorial-Mounts/Celestron-Omni-XLT-120-Refractor-Telescope/pc/1/c/10/sc/335/p/9021.uts
Mine is older though, its white. They don't make mine anymore. I bought it for 559.00 when I got it. It came with a nice firm equatorial mount and I got a 2x barlow with it. But this is the biggest refractor you can buy for that low of a price. Usually you'd spend a lot more for a scope of this quality. Its the easiest scope to use and the views of the planets are incredible, as is the moon.
I also have the little 80 rich tube scope that's good for richfield viewing (still a refractor though).
I don't like reflectors, just too much trouble to maintain. I like just walking outside (I live in a dark sky area, far from any cities or towns) and start viewing.
But like I said, don't let this discourage you. Try the reflector out and see how you do with it.
But if it doesn't work well for you, (especially if you're in a light polluted area) then try a refractor before giving up. You won't be sorry.
Why is there something rather than nothing??
ReplyDeleteExactly Cassius. Why is there something, rather than nothing. That's the question.
And the size of the universe may be relative to something much larger.No doubt.
When you start going back to the beginning, even the most devout atheist comes to grips with the one glaring question, "where did it all come from". The big bang only answers a step in the process.
But where did the primordial atom come from? What caused it to expand and heat up? And what was behind what caused it?
If you ask the right questions, at one point you'll realize you leave the natural and come face to face with what can only be deemed the supernatural. Something beyond what our mortal minds can fathom.
Congratulation luke. You've taken another step into a larger world.
Thanks for the info Worf......always interesting!
ReplyDeleteIve loved and studied astronomy for decades and always possessed a small quality refractor and 10 x 50 binoculars but must admit that I'm rather ignorant on the subject of reflector usage.
I bought it on the spur of the moment as a bargain happened along....I was not aware of the maintenance and moisture issues.........now I'm a little bummed! I am a little worried about the tracking as well.
Mine is the exact one at the top the Bushnell homepage......looks like two chicks are peering into it. I have a 114 mm mirror with an additional 3x Barlow lens.
http://www.bushnell.com/astronomy/?skipSelector=true
I clicked on your link to see your telescope but the picture wont appear?
Just go to telescope.com and click the Refractors with Equatorial mounts link. Its the 120mm.
ReplyDeleteAs for your scope, I don't know how large a mirror would be on a reflector since I've never owned one and buy only refractors, but on their website I see two reflectors. A 3 inch and a 4.5. The 3 inch has a focal length of 700 mm and the 4.5 has a focal length of 900mm.
So I assume yours is one of those. The 3 inch is pretty small as reflectors go. The planets aren't going to look very good through it, but the Barlow will help that.
The 4.5 looks nice. That's about where you want to start with reflectors. Planets will be reasonably visible through it and bigger ones like Jupiter and Saturn will actually look like planets, albeit relatively small.
These are Bushnell so I bet the lens are top quality though, so you should get good views with either of the moon. The moon should look awesome with the 4.5 inch model and a Barlow.
The one thing I did notice was both have electronic go to drives so tracking objects will be a breeze once you familiarize yourself with the software.
Just remember, the key to effective viewing with a reflector is a dark sky. If you live near street lights and such, your views are going to be dismal. A reflector gathers a lot more light than a refractor, so any light source in the area will wash out any dimmer far away objects. That's why reflectors are so much cheaper on average (per aperture size) than refractors. Because with a reflector you're not looking directly at an object, you're looking at a reflection of it off a mirror whereas with a refractor you have to have more lens to get equal sizes. But a refractor's going to do much better in brighter skies and give better overall image quality. Its the lenses your paying for. And refractors have larger ones and more of them.
ReplyDeleteSo if you don't live near a dark sky then you'll want to take your new reflector out to a field somewhere far from the city to use it.
For just the moon though you should get pretty good views regardless, as long as there isn't too much light nearby.
Usually for a reflector 20 miles from the nearest city is considered good viewing if its planets or deep sky objects you want to view. The less light around, the better.
And since you're already into astronomy I guess I don't have tell you the best time to view the moon isn't when its full or near full, but when its a crescent. That's when you'll see more 3 dimensional and crisp views of it. Of course even when its 3 quarters you can view well into craters if you train your sights on the dark\light delimiter. Right where the moon goes into shadow gives the best inside the crater views. The shadows on the moon are awesome.
ReplyDeleteBy the way, looking at your scopes again I'm not sure those are motorized. I do think it has some sort of tracking system though.
ReplyDeleteWhat it calls the illuminated "smart mount" guides you so either way it sounds like its got tracking covered.
It looks like a nice sturdy equatorial mount with it. That makes it a lot easier. I manually sight in the planets, but I'm used to where they are each night so I don't have to hunt for them. I'm sure you are too. But I'd use the tracking system that came with it on a reflector to make it easier to track stuff in.
By the way, with a 114mm mirror that's 4.49 inches so you got their larger 4.5 inch 900mm focal length scope.
ReplyDeleteThat's good. You should have fun with that.
No,my telescope does not have an electronic drive,but the dials work pretty good though......smooth and accurate!
ReplyDeleteI tried it out last night under less than ideal conditions......I couldn't wait anymore.....lol!
Around ten o'clock last night I began focusing on a very bright full moon through numerous tree branches,wispy clouds,and unstable atmosphere.
When I finally focused on the moon I was simply astounded by the clear,crisp,quality of the view......exceeded my expectations!
However,the moon was so bright that my eye began to hurt.I changed lenses for a closer view but it was far too powerful. Only a very tiny fraction of our celestial neighbour came into my sight. I did manage to get a brief focus and it was just like you said......it felt like I was walking on the moon.
One thing for sure,you cant even fart when using it as the slightest disturbance causes it to quiver.
Yes, like I said place a weight like a heavy flash lite (I use my maglite) or a brick or something on the center tray. Also push the legs into the dirt. Like I said, a reflectors going to be even more subject to movement than a refractor, but both need to be firmly planted.
ReplyDeleteAlso looking through trees is not advised. It blurs the image. You need a clear sky.
As for the full moon, that's not the best to look at like I said. When the moon is a not full you'll see much better views by looking at the dark side and the light\dark perimeter where you can see shadow, shapes, etc.
That's cool you got the moon in though. Good job. Now just wait a week or so for the crescent moon to come in and you'll be blown away.
ReplyDeleteAlso keep in mind this is the BEST time to look at planets.
Jupiter is up. So is Venus. Saturn will be out too. Mars and Mercury.
So find some good dark spot and start planet gazing.
You might try using "STELLARIUM", which is software you can download for free that gives you a little planetarium on your computer so you can see where everything's going to be at in the night sky based on your location.
It needs a powerful computer though. Its slow on a weak one.
Here Johnny. You can download the software here.
ReplyDeletehttp://stellarium.org/
This is really good software but like I said don't try to run it on your IPOD or something. It needs a good computer with a good video card. Like a gaming system.
OK,thanx,Worf,I will check it out more thoroughly when I get a little more spare time.
ReplyDeleteJust curious.Have you ever heard of "Yosemite Half Dome?"
I know a bit about Half Dome. Why?
ReplyDeleteYou're talking about the granite wall at Yosemite National Park, right? What about it?
ReplyDeleteWell,some guy from the United States subscribed to my YouTube channel and he appears to be a rock climber or something.
ReplyDeleteHe has a video of himself at the Yosemite Half Dome.
If he's on the side of Half Dome that would be a safe bet.
ReplyDeletePowerful,powerful,bummer ......I forgot about the Venus transit and missed it.
ReplyDelete:(
I just watched it on the internet. Without the right filters you can't look at it anyway.
ReplyDeleteFirst they came for the communists,
ReplyDeleteand I didn't speak out because I wasn't a communist.
Then they came for the trade unionists,
and I didn't speak out because I wasn't a trade unionist.
Then they came for the Jews,
and I didn't speak out because I wasn't a Jew.
Then they came for me
and there was no one left to speak out for me.
Americans today too stupid or apathetic to learn from history, are on track to repeat it.
ReplyDeleteWe get the government, we deserve.
It was nice to see Scott Walker say he wanted to heal the divide after retaining his seat. That's a good sign.
ReplyDeleteAnd I think we all agree that Unions can get out of hand and corruption can seep in. But I think most of us will also agree that the Government can get out of hand and corruption can seep in. So I think and hope we all agree that a balance needs to exist.
We don't throw out the baby with the bathwater. We weed out corruption, but we don't toss out the baby with the bathwater.
One things for sure. If republicans and democrats don't figure out how to work together again, this country just might be screwed.
At least for now.
I think what's going to happen is we're going to grow old, arguing at each other. And probably our older first generation of kids might. But I think our kids and grandkids are going to grow sick of our nonsense, and like most major social shifts will abandon our nonsense in favor of the alternative, i.e. cooperation.
ReplyDeleteI think at one point, cooperation's going to be cool again. And when it is things will start to work again.
I'm just worried about how long that's going to take.
And at this point, who knows. It might be better if Romney wins. Because if he does, all this gridlocks going to go away.
ReplyDeleteSuddenly republicans will have no problem raising the debt ceiling and providing stimulus and job incentives for the newly minted President. Suddenly the debt ceiling won't be an issue.
Just like it wasn't an issue, when they raised it EIGHT TIMES under Bush, and multiple other times for every president in modern history.
But under the black man, its suddenly an issue.
They're not going to give the black man any money. Nothing.
They don't want him to get reelected, so they are intentionally crashing the economy to ensure that he doesn't win.
Of course, that's the same thing Pelosi and Reid did in 2007 to get him elected, so I guess they figure they got one coming.
Problem is, we the people, are the ones who suffer.
The problem isn't republicans and it isn't democrats. Its "republicans and democrats".
And this new, "scorched earth" policy from both sides and "win at all costs" is the crux of the problem.
Unless we decide that the country, the people and our success as a nation is more important than their own, petty little ideologies and political victories then we'll never move out of this quagmire we're all stuck in.
Learning to get along again, and to LOOK like a Nation, instead of a bickering 3rd world banana republic, is what's going to move us forward.
We did it before. Our parents did it. I'm just worried it'll have to be our children who do it rather than us.
I'm afraid we're going to end up as the "joke generation" in US history. The group of petty, bickering rubes more obsessed with the argument rather than the answer.
"Learning to get along again"
ReplyDelete:D
Well said,but be careful,as its blatantly obvious that you've been ingesting both red & blue pills at the same time.......this causes great confusion!
But,there is hope for this dilemma. I m currently working on a new formula that enhances brainwave clarity while altering chaotic thought patterns.
Well that's good Johnny, but I think the kids these days already know how to mix beer and Red Bull.
ReplyDeleteHearing Jeb Bush point out that the current right wing has moved so far to the right that he wouldn't be a fit was wake up call for everyone.
ReplyDeleteAnd when he pointed out that were he offered a 10 to 1 spending cut\spending deal he'd have jumped at it spoke volumes to the extremist views being pushed on both sides.
Because at the same time, we hear the White House say that they're not going to budge on extending the Bush tax cuts for the wealthy if it means tax cuts for the middle and small business, shows that same sort of hard line, partisan extremism that is ripping this country apart.
Of course Obama has for the most part tried to work with republicans and they refuse to work with him.
ReplyDeleteBut seeing that same hard line coming back now on the Bush tax cut extension is a disturbing development.
With Bill Clinton, who knows how to drive an economy tells you to take the deal, you take the deal. You don't draw a line in the sand and refuse to play.
Clinton said we don't need anything that might stall the economy and he's right there. Its probably best to not fight this one, as long as republicans aren't asking for huge welfare cuts or cuts in medicare or social security instead.
So the President needs to just let them extend the whole thing, temporarily, to keep the economy from stalling.
But for some reason they came out and said "NO", sounding just like the republicans who keep saying no to them.
That's not going to work. We need the sort of reasonable approach we heard Jeb Bush talking about.
Everyone can't have their own way.
Everyone has to be willing to compromise if anything's going to work.
Here's how extending the Bush tax cuts is a win win deal for everyone.
ReplyDeleteFor republicans, its a win because they can show that Bush did something right, and that their ideas about low taxes can help keep an economy moving forward.
For democrats, its a win because it will help keep the economy from stalling, in turn helping the President at least go into November on even ground.
And while Clinton's backtracking now and trying to say he didn't realize that "they don't expire to until after December", the truth is of course he knew that, he doesn't miss a thing. He's just using that as an excuse for what he said but the fact is US businesses are sitting on their money and hiring slowly because they want to see who wins the election since Obama insists that they'll be paying more in taxes if he wins.
ReplyDeleteHe's hobbling his own campaign.
If he'd capitulate on the Bush tax cut extensions and announce that he'll extend them then businesses might loosen up now and start spending again. Spending on hiring, lending, development, etc.
Of course for that to work, republicans need to stop letting the Tea Party push them around and give on these spending cuts.
ReplyDeleteFor it to work, both sides needs to be willing to give and take.
Warmest U.S. spring on record: NOAA
ReplyDeleteBy Deborah Zabarenko | Reuters – 20 hrs ago
WASHINGTON (Reuters) - So far, 2012 has been the warmest year the United States has ever seen, with the warmest spring and the second-warmest May since record-keeping began in 1895, the U.S. National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration reported on Thursday.
Temperatures for the past 12 months and the year-to-date have been the warmest on record for the contiguous United States, NOAA said.
Global warming isn't a partisan issue and politicians shouldn't be weighing in their "opinions" on it, from either side.
Al Gore probably did more damage to combating global warming by doing that movie than he did good, as it just widened the divide and made it look like a partisan issue.
Its not.
Its a matter for science. Not politics and it needs to stay that way.
Agreed. So let scientists worry about it.
ReplyDeleteRegarding your telescope Johnny, is it a yoke or equatorial mount?
ReplyDeleteTracking objects is MUCH easier with an equatorial.
Scientists are doing it.
ReplyDeleteProblem is, republicans are out saying "nuh uh" and fighting it at every turn.
Do we actually have to remind you of "drill baby drill"?
And Johnny and I already talked about his equatorial mount days ago.
ReplyDeleteAnd what sort of Newtonian telescope have you ever seen that came with a "yoke" mount?
ReplyDeleteIts a Bushnell, not a "Buck Rogers official telescope".
Figured the first time I mentioned global warming you'd crawl out of your hole.
ReplyDeleteAnd as usual, note the anti-science throwbacks description on how to handle global warming.
ReplyDeleteLet the scientists "worry" about it.
"Worry".
Don't "DO" anything about it mind you.
Just let the scientists "worry" about it.
Because that's how these people want to deal with the problem.
They don't want us to "listen" to science. They don't want us to "do" anything science tells us to do about it.
They just want to ignore it and let science "worry" about it.
This is why its sad Al Gore did that movie. Because he fed into their nonsense that its a political issue, which it isn't.
Its a matter for science to study and explain and instruct us on, and from there as a people its our job to follow their instructions on it.
End of story.
Unfortunately the republicans of today being fed by big oil, were told by big oil to fight the issue. So they get their little minions like we see in here out to spread their anti science bullshit like they do in here, turning it into a partisan issue of "he said, she said".
ReplyDeleteWhich it isn't.
Its a matter for science and science tells us what we need to do.
Problem is, EXXON doesn't want us doing it. And since EXXON along with the other big oil giants are the masters of the republican party, ...well.....we're stuck with "drill baby drill".
Which really is more like ..."burn baby burn".
What this country needs is a MASS exodus from the parties to the center. Particularly from the far right republican party.
ReplyDeleteThe sort of trolls like voltron who've infested this blog since its inception are not the solution, they're the problem.
This country has had enough of that sort of hard line partisan insanity.
What we need are moderates to come forward from all sides and join together to come up with ways to work with WHOEVER gets elected.
If Obama wins again, then we need to move FORWARD as a country. Not get stuck in 4 more years of gridlock caused by hard line republican hacks playing up to the insanity that is the tea party.
If Romney wins, then we need to move FORWARD as a country and accept him as President, and find common ground where we can drive the economy forward while ending our dependence on foreign oil.
It can be done. But its going to take reasonable people who believe in teamwork, not partisan hacks selling their party line schtick.
Global Warming isn't a partisan issue, and there isn't a good, decent soul on the planet who would ignore such a devastating threat to our own habitation, or the world we hand to those who come after us.
Same with the economy.
ReplyDeleteDebt ceilings never been an issue, until a black democrat took office.
Then suddenly we can't raise the debt ceiling. Even though under Bush, the republicans didn't mind raising it EIGHT times.
Of course anyone with a functional brain can immediately see its just more of the far right wing fanatical strategy to crash the economy so they can blame it on Obama.
Boehner announces that he's not going to raise the debt ceiling and the DOW crashes for a week straight. Boehner knew that's what would happen.
That's what he wanted.
Slow the growth, hurt the economy, make people lose their money and then he can say "See, its Obama's fault".
This is the lowest form of politics known to man, and its not just Boehner and the right wing doing it. As I've pointed out MANY times, Nancy Pelosi did the exact same thing in 2007 when they yanked the rug out on the housing market to crash the economy so they could get Obama elected. And it was sick.
Its the worst sort of politics you can play in a democratic republic and it needs to stop.
We need moderates, men and women of reason, judgement and commitment to making it work. Enough with the partisan hacks.
And the media's a big part of the problem. On the right we've got Fox fake news, with their openly right wing goosestep agenda being promulgated 24 hours a day, 7 days a week. With hacks like "Gretchen Carlson", the cross eyed angry bitch of the right, no actual "news" gets reported. Just partisan bullshit.
ReplyDeleteAnd on the left, we've got MSNBC, who while not as bad as the right, certainly is fueling the fire with lily livered whining worms like David Corn or the loud mouthed Ed Schultz, pushing nothing but pure left wing partisan bullshit.
Enough.
We need "news" again. A free and impartial press. And we don't have it.
Ever since CNN introduced the 24 hour news cycle, the news has turned into nothing more than puppets of one of the two political parties. And it SUCKS.
We need to wake up, tell these losers to get a job and get on with the business of making America work.
So let scientists worry about it.
ReplyDeleteThey are volty;
Global Extinction within one Human Lifetime as a Result of a Spreading Atmospheric Arctic Methane Heat wave and Surface Firestorm
They are;
.... and now because of the right wing monetary funnelled politically motivated denialism, the possibility we might be too late, to stop events like described in the link above, now exists.
Volt
ReplyDeleteYes,it is an equatorial mount.Why,do you have a telescope too? And, if you do, what type is it?
Worf
ReplyDeleteYou’ve been making some good sense lately but remember not everyone can be reasoned or bargained with.
You yourself have clearly admitted that the whole spectrum of human emotion needs to be taken into account. Power, greed, boredom, money, mental instability, apathy, etc.......all play important roles in determining the final outcome for any given scenario.....logic and reasoning, more often than not, take a back seat when it comes to getting along.
There will always be war!
Oh,yeah,my dad brought me back a bottle of rum (1.75litre) from Saginaw and I almost fainted at the price.......
ReplyDelete.....eighteen smackers!!
:D
The same bottle up here is at least 50 bucks.....Canadians are taxed to death!!!
:|
ReplyDeletebut remember not everyone can be reasoned or bargained with.
Well, your playing your usual role of devils advocate aside, you're right. Not everyone can be reasoned or bargained with.
Hard line Tea Party republicans refuse to reason or bargain, compromise, etc.
They just want to say "NO!" to everything and anything President Obama says.
Which is why as I stated, we need to move past the hard line right wing fanatics, like voltron here, who's role is to tear down and destroy, rather than find common ground and build.
There's two types of people in life Johnny.
Those who create.
And those who destroy.
The tea party's the latter.
We need to find those of the former. We have plenty of the latter type.
Power, greed, boredom, money, mental instability, apathy, etc.......all play important roles in determining the final outcome for any given scenario.....logic and reasoning, more often than not, take a back seat when it comes to getting along.
ReplyDeleteThere will always be war!
There will as long as people believe there must be.
The truth though?
Much different.
The fact is as man has evolved over the centuries, war has diminished along with violence and ignorance.
War has diminished over the ages, and this proves that man can move away from that sort of ignorance and into a better way.
Thus, there will only "always be war" as long as there are people like you.
But as man evolves, our lust for war will devolve.
So as the gene pool weeds out the dull and warlike man will continue to evolve into a more enlightened and intelligent being.
See Johnny, what you just said, is a lie.(not calling you a liar).
You might not know it but its a lie. There will not always be war.
Man will evolve. Because the truth?
There's ENOUGH FOR EVERYONE.
There is enough food, land, water and wealth, for EVERYONE to have sufficient for their needs.
But the attributes you listed, "greed" in particular, which is a mainstay staple of the republicans of today, is the reason that enough isn't enough.
But eventually, as our young people grow up and escape the indoctrination of the old hard line right wing push for guns, war, greed, apathy and avarice, we'll see generations grow that want nothing to with their parents folly.
So no Johnny, there will not always be war.
There will only be war as long as the tired, old apathetic and greedy rule the halls of power.
But that's changing, slowly perhaps, but it will not remain.
Out with the old, in with the new.
Volt
ReplyDeleteYes,it is an equatorial mount.Why,do you have a telescope too? And, if you do, what type is it?
Apparently its a "Johnny Space Commander Official Star Watcher Telescope", ....if he's got a Newtonian with a "yoke" mount, lol.
What we need to do here in the states Johnny, is demand term limits for congress.
ReplyDeleteEvery fat ass sitting in that capital building today that's been there more than 2 terms, on both sides of the aisle, are nothing but lazy, good for nothing FREELOADERS.
Sucking off the public teat to keep their cushy jobs, and cushy lifestyles.
They don't want to work for a living. They want to be fed.
Fed by the public tax dollar.
Fed by the special interest groups.
Fed by corporate wealth and lobbyists.
They need to go.
THATS when America will start to function again.
That and when we start electing people for their brains again, and not how big their mouths are.
The irony of course being these same freeloaders on the right wing side of the house, are busy telling their constituents how they're going to get the freeloaders off welfare.
ReplyDeleteThe pot as it were, calling the kettle black.
There is hope for America Johnny, but only as long as we have hope and hold out for something better.
As long as naysayers, negative thinkers, believers in the least in man instead of the best in man, ...those who focus on what we cannot do rather than what we can do are the loudest voices, then nothing will change.
We need positive people, winners. People willing to work with the other side and make things happen if we're going to move forward. That negative, defeatist attitude you so gleefully herald is the problem, not the solution. Its in the way.
You know who I would have voted for if he'd got the nomination?
John Huntsmen.
Huntsmen had one quality that stood out from the rest of the pack of republican candidates.
That quality?
He cared more about the country, than he did the party.
Huntsman didn't care which party the President belonged to. He was willing to work for his country and put aside partisan differences. When a democratic President called him to serve, he simply declared "I serve at the pleasure of the President" and served his country honorably, just as he did when a republican President called him.
Unfortunately this was the one quality that is not welcome in the modern Tea Party controlled right wing.
So they canned him and canned him quick.
If Huntsman had gotten the nod, then the country would be on its way to healing. But he didn't.
I do hold out hope though that Romney's better self will break through here at one point. Probably won't happen in the campaign though. He wants to win too badly to offend the gun toting, sign waving, frothing at the mouth rabid Tea Party loons, so he capitulates to them at every turn.
But I think deep down Romney's probably a lot more reasonable and balanced than he comes across. I might be wrong and only time will tell if he wins, but I do think if he gets in (and if he locates his spinal cord) that he'll be more of a moderate than he appears to be right now.
Right now though he's just making a fool of himself trying to appease the Tea Party and refusal to admit when he's wrong, such as in the auto industry bailout that he spoke out against until it worked and then tried to take credit for.
So who knows? But the fact is its Congress that needs change. Congress and the news. We need to stop fueling this new partisan divide that did not exist when I was a young man and start looking for common ground with those of reason and commitment to making it work.
One things for sure. Right now the campaign tactics from both sides is a bad sign.
ReplyDeleteNeither side is telling us what they'll do that's right.
All they're doing is telling us what the other side will do that's wrong.
These attack ads coming from Obama are stupid. They feed the fire and show the left no better than the right when it comes to partisanship.
Obama needs to focus on what he's done right and what he will do right, rather than what Romney will do or has done wrong.
And Romney needs to talk about what he'll do right, rather than what Obama's done wrong.
Its the only way we're going to bridge the divide and start to resemble a country again.
"Johnny Space Commander Official Star Watcher Telescope"
ReplyDeleteLOL
:D
I have to agree with you on the John Huntsmen thing........America definitely needs some kind of positive change and he sounds like the right man to get the job done.
ReplyDeleteOr you could sell your ports to the U.A.E for a little extra cash.
Remember that?
Worf said:
ReplyDelete"We need positive people, winners. People willing to work with the other side and make things happen if we're going to move forward."
.................
"Hope! It is the quintessential human delusion, simultaneously the source of your greatest strength and your greatest weakness."
The Architect
"Hope! It is the quintessential human delusion, simultaneously the source of your greatest strength and your greatest weakness."
ReplyDeleteThe Architect
As no doubt scientifically viable and factual as one would expect a quote from a modern science fiction movie to be, this one unfortunately falls far from reality.
Hope is the essence of all human achievement. Coming from a family that fought Nazi Germany and Imperial Japan in World War II I have been acquainted throughout the years with power of faith and hope coupled with the real action needed to bring the focus of that hope to fruition.
Of course hope by itself without accompanying action is pointless. But hope with action is the seed by which all great human endeavor has been achieved.
Unfortunately there will always be the weak, sloth ridden opposition of the naysayers, who will always tell others how "it cannot be done". Fortunately life and history itself eventually rolls over these like so much rubbish left to spoil in the wake of an invading army.
Whether you believe you can do something, or can't do something, you will always be right.
ReplyDeleteOr you could sell your ports to the U.A.E for a little extra cash.
Remember that?
Yes, another example of the brilliance of the Bush administration.
ReplyDeleteI have to agree with you on the John Huntsmen thing........America definitely needs some kind of positive change and he sounds like the right man to get the job done.
Well he would have been. Huntsman had a true sense of duty to God and country. He was the sort of man who set high ideals and standards for himself, then lived up to them.
When Ronald Reagan called him to serve he did.
When the older, wiser George H. W. Bush called him to serve his country, he did.
When the younger, dumber George W Bush called him to serve, he did.
And when President Barak Obama called him to serve, even though the President was a democrat, hated by the Tea Party republicans and branded a socialist, he said "I serve at the pleasure of the President", and he resigned his governorship of Utah, to serve his country as US Ambassador to China. A good appointment being he speaks fluent Mandarin (no small feat in and of itself).
This of course burned the Tea Party with their angry, frothing at the mouth partisan hatred and he was blacklisted. The republicans barely paid him any attention during the primaries.
And of course the news media all but ignored him. After all, he was just too perfect. Had too much on the ball for the muck raking press to be interested in.
Here's a guy who is a Mormon, honors his faith but embraces all others, married an Episcopalian, sends his kids to Catholic school and adopted a daughter from India who he raises in her native Hindu religion.
You know the evangelical based Tea Party isn't going to sit well with all that.
But worse? Here's a man of faith who has no problem embracing science and in spite of the threats of the rabid, foaming at the mouth Tea Party lunatics declared without reservation;
"Republicans should not become the "anti-science" party, ...
..."to be clear. I believe in evolution and trust scientists on global warming.
Call me crazy "
Couple this with his open willingness to put his partisan politics aside and step up and serve his country and President with honor, regardless of which party that President belongs to, ...and you have a candidate that is the quintessential enemy of all that the Tea Party stands for and proclaims.
Huntsman had class, and all the Tea Party has is ass.
If Romney has any character whatsoever (or balls) he'd pick Jon Huntsman as his running mate. This would be a strong message to the Tea Party that he will not be ruled by coercion and threat, and that he intends if elected, to work with the opposition for the good of the country.
ReplyDeleteIt will be interesting to see who he picks. Will he go with a moderate who will set the stage for a government that works and move beyond the pathetic petty partisan gridlock we've endured for the last 12 years?
Or will he capitulate to the rabid Tea Party rabble and pick some hard line partisan lunatic, like Palin or Perry, thus sealing his fate as a puppet of the party and little more than a talking figurehead that will go in whatever direction those winding his key point him in?
I wait with baited breath.
"this one unfortunately falls far from reality."
ReplyDeleteCompletely disagree!!
So,Worf,do you have hope that you could be a very successful ice-cube salesman to the Eskimos on Baffin Island?
Or,possessing two broken arms and one broken leg,do you have hope that you could wipe-out 20 baseball bat wielding thugs who wish to beat you to a pulp?
Often,I have been asked why I would stay in such a destructive marriage?
My reply........
..........HOPE!
I'm not implying that an individual should not have hope......far from it.......I'm simply saying (and this is important) that hope MUST be gauged CAREFULLY with both reason and logic.
Many times I have seen foolish people with exceedingly high hopes that their ideas would be very successful whereas I knew they were doomed for failure......they did not gauge their hope properly which led to disaster!
The term"over-optimistic" is in the English vocabulary for a reason. Thus,the above metaphor is 100% correct....period!
Remember, for every thesis there is an anti-thesis.
Almost forgot.
ReplyDeleteIn the end Hitler had hope as well and each day that he did millions suffered even though the rest of the world knew he was doomed.
Debbie the Downer said...
ReplyDeleteSo,Worf,do you have hope that you could be a very successful ice-cube salesman to the Eskimos on Baffin Island?
uhhh, mee thinks your problem is confusing hope in realistic goals and aspirations with fantasyland.
Having hope that people can work together is not absurd. Its been done before.
A whining loser said...
ReplyDeleteThe term"over-optimistic" is in the English vocabulary for a reason. Thus,the above metaphor is 100% correct....period!
No, its not. No one is suggesting that hope in fairy tales and nonsense is to be pursued.
Hope in reasonably obtainable goals is not a weakness.
It is a strength.
Of course, the weak willed spineless jellyfish, apparently like yourself who whine, whimper and roll over at every inkling of a little hard work and commitment probably do see such things as two political parties working together for the good of a country as something unobtainable.
But its not.
Its been done before.
And since your so fond of movie quotes (its ok, I am too), then I'll let you muse on this one.
"...what one man can do, another man can do!"
Anthony Hopkins from "The Edge"
Remember, for every thesis there is an anti-thesis.
ReplyDeleteMore loser mentality nonsense.
Just because you "say" the opposite of something, doesn't give it credence in reality.
For example.
I know that 2+2=4.
There is no "anti-thesis" to that. Its fact, whether one chooses to "believe" it or not.
I understand the quote from your beloved movie but hope in that which can be obtained through discipline and hard work is not a weakness.
It is the core of all human worthwhile endeavor.
And the only things we have to overcome when it comes to working together as a people are our own prejudices and feelings and of course the losers like you who whine about how it cannot or will not be done.
Once you get past the whining naysayers, progress comes.
We've done it before. We can do it again.
And as for those people who hope for something that may be too far out of reach, I have this to say.
ReplyDeleteMany a billionaire laughs at people like you with your negativity and naysaying "republican't" attitude.
Look at J.K Rowling. Here's a woman living on welfare, starving trying to survive.
If she'd told you she's writing a book that's going to make her the richest author in the world, no doubt you'd have showered her with your negative whining "concerns" that her hope and expectations are too high.
Just as other humans who've overcome great and seemingly impossible odds to do achieve great things, no doubt plagued by the "glass half empty" whiners and losers who focus on what cannot be done, rather than on what CAN be done.
I've seen in my life things that others said were impossible. I've seen massive strength out of a tiny mother to save a child. I've seen people return from fatal disease who were given up to death by the medical world.
I've seen the impossible achieved, by those who had hope.
It doesn't "always" happen, sure. But without hope, it NEVER happens.
Its like the old saying I've tried to pound into your head over the years Johnny, one you'd do well to muse on rather than the nonsense you feed on from the Matrix.
It goes like this;
"I'd rather shoot at the moon and miss, ....than shoot at nothing and hit it".
Consider the famous inventor, Thomas Alva Edison. He tried thousands of times and failed to produce a viable lightbulb.
ReplyDeleteHad Johnny Moo Moo been his assistant no doubt Edison would have given up, capitulating to Moo Moo's incessant whining about how it'll never work.
But Edison didn't give up and when asked about his failure declared he'd "not failed" on any of the attempts.
He simply found a thousand ways to not invent a lightbulb.
“Opportunity is missed by most people because it is dressed in overalls and looks like work.”
ReplyDeleteThomas Alva Edison
“Our greatest weakness lies in giving up.
ReplyDeleteThe most certain way to succeed is always to try just one more time.”
Thomas Alva Edison
First off pickle breath I clearly said:
ReplyDeleteI'm not implying that an individual should not have hope......far from it.......I'm simply saying (and this is important) that hope MUST be gauged CAREFULLY with both reason and logic.
Mr. Overly Optimistic said:
ReplyDelete“confusing hope in realistic goals”
“No one is suggesting that hope in fairy tales and nonsense is to be pursued.”
“Hope in reasonably obtainable goals”
LOL……………your funny Worf!
The problem with your completely ridiculous logic is that one man’s vision of realistic and obtainable goals is another man’s idea of absurdity and vice-versa.
The above statements you wrote clearly indicate that hope has limits based on the reasoning of the individual thus you have literally agreed with my point of view………..LOL!
Please enlighten us on what your version of “reasonably obtainable goals “are because there will be millions out there to oppose your personal vision………period!
There are many out there who have “hope” that one day liberals will cease to exist. And, there are others who have “hope” that Islam will be the one and only religion. Some have “hope” that black people won’t be part of western society anymore while others have great “hope” that gays won’t be able to marry.
Recently, some Jehovah’s Witness came around the neighborhood and tried to push their belief on others in the “hope” (albeit misguided) that we would see the light………I gauged their vision of “hope’ as ………silly and futile! I have little “hope” that they won’t come back……………LOL!
Also, I have little “hope" that everyone will accept my point of view just like I have little ‘hope’ that one day mankind will evolve into a Smurf like village where everyone holds hands and sings Kumbaya by a campfire. Without strife there would be no purpose and nothing to strive for!
But, I do have hope that I will eat dinner tonight and get some sleep.
There will always be war………period!
And by the way Johnny Downer, you know of course I don't actually think you're a loser or "spineless jellyfish". ...ok, maybe a (spiney Jellyfish:). That's just to spark a thought or two in that negative, glass half full mentality of yours.
ReplyDeleteThis world doesn't need anymore naysayers and whiners. We need winners. We don't need "can't do" mentalities. We have all those we need for now.
What we need are the CAN DO's. Winners. Those committed to doing what it takes to make it work.
Those who might fall on their face 100 times, but keep getting back up, dusting themselves off and keep trying.
You ever hear the term "either lead, follow or get out of the way!" ?
Go thou, and do likewise.
“I know that 2+2=4”
ReplyDeleteI’m talking about human nature and its philosophies ………………not mathematics garlic lips!
“Many a billionaire laughs at people like you with your negativity and naysaying”
ReplyDeleteSometimes luck and not perseverance determines ones success in life.
JMM
Hope can be your best friend, however, it can also be your worst enemy…………………period
ReplyDelete……………………………………………………………………
ReplyDelete"I'd rather shoot at the moon and miss, ....than shoot at nothing and hit it"
Not me! I would prefer to gauge such an endeavour before participating in it.
Of course, I am “The One.”
ReplyDelete:D
Debbie Downer said...
ReplyDeleteAlso, I have little “hope" that everyone will accept my point of view just like I have little ‘hope’ that one day mankind will evolve into a Smurf like village where everyone holds hands and sings Kumbaya by a campfire. Without strife there would be no purpose and nothing to strive for!
Ok, maybe I spoke too soon.
Your "smurf like village" and "Kumbaya" references put you back into the loser category.
See those are terms and far fetched nonsense used by right wing fanatics and extremists to downplay the reality of a functional democratic republic.
Those who use such terms expose themselves as the whining, naysayers and lazy loafers who inflate their own deluded egos by estimating all of mankind to be as ineffectual as themselves.
Its not my fault you have mental instabilities and can't handle relationships.
That's your problem.
But it doesn't mean the rest of the world cannot.
There are the dysfunctional like yourself, and there are the functional.
Painting the idea of the two parties working together for the good of the nation, something they did even under Bill Clinton and Newt Gingrich (need I remind you of such successes as "Capital Gains"?) and its been done throughout history.
The problem is not that it doesn't work.
The problem is people like you, don't work.
Getting past the losers like you, is all it takes.
I have to go and check out some cabinets and will continue our debate later.......always a pleasure ripping your turban!!
ReplyDelete:)
I have hope that I will rip it good...LOL!
Johnny Loserville said...
ReplyDelete……………………………………………………………………
Not me! I would prefer to gauge such an endeavour before participating in it.
You mean "endeavor" and I know.
That is why you fail.
Luke Skywalker: "I can't believe it"
ReplyDeleteYoda: "That is why you fail".
Johnny Loser said...
ReplyDeleteThere will always be war………period!
The only "period" there is the one you're on.
As for there always being war, no, war has diminished as mankind has evolved.
Eventually the gene pool will weed out losers and whining wimps like yourself, and war will be no more.
So a more accurate way for you to state that is;
"There will always be war, as long as there are whining losers and quitters like me" - JMM
LOL, Speaking of "hope"...
ReplyDeleteThis is the big mistake in the liberal mindset. The belief in the perfectibility of man.
Whether you believe in evolution or creation, the base nature of man has not changed in 6000 or 6 million years.
Greed, lust, envy, they've existed since the beginning of time and they're not going anywhere anytime soon.
When our sun turns into a cold black hunk of coal the seven deadly sins will still exist.
What you do when you encourage those around you to beat their swords into plowshares is to make us all vulnerable to the next greedy bastard who still has his sword.
"As for there always being war, no, war has diminished as mankind has evolved."
ReplyDeleteYou mean like the two world wars of the twentieth century were not nearly as bloody as any of the wars prior?
"Eventually the gene pool will weed out losers and whining wimps like yourself, and war will be no more."
I think what you mean here is "eventually the gene pool will weed out the realists and the strong, and war will be no more because our new masters won't allow it." (unless it benefits them)
Oh and Johnny,
ReplyDeleteI had a refractor with an equatorial mount when I was younger. Spent many a cool autumn evening looking at Jupiter and Saturn.
It's a pleasurable way to pass a nice clear night.
I also had a subscription to "Sky and Telescope" magazine. Very entertaining and educational. If they're still around I recommend it.
“Whether you believe in evolution or creation, the base nature of man has not changed in 6000 or 6 million years.Greed, lust, envy, they've existed since the beginning of time and they're not going anywhere anytime soon.
ReplyDeleteWhen our sun turns into a cold black hunk of coal the seven deadly sins will still exist.”
Thank you......a realist!
Here is a little, but well known quote to back up your very rational statement:
“Times change, people don’t.”
the realists and the strong,
ReplyDeletelol, the only thing "strong" about you is your odor.
"I think what you mean here is "eventually the gene pool will weed out the realists and the strong, and war will be no more."
ReplyDeleteBrilliant!!!
:D
And people do change Johnny, Voltron's ignorance of history and the frequency of war not withstanding.
ReplyDelete"Some people" never change.
But over time, most eventually do.
"I had a refractor with an equatorial mount when I was younger. Spent many a cool autumn evening looking at Jupiter and Saturn."
ReplyDeleteThat is cool Volt,I didn't know that about you. Somewhere the answers out there?
I could watch the stars all night.
You see, Worf, I’m not disagreeing with your ideas and I actually despise war, but my enormous study of human history has led me to 100% believe that we are truly incapable of getting along and I therefore remain firm in my view........I knew I should have stuck to “Archie” comic books as a kid!
ReplyDeleteBTW, here is an American chick who commented on one of my popular YouTube videos today:
“ i have traveled everywhere in this beautiful Country looking for that "One Place" and i can truley say.. there is no place.there's always some fucken loser or stupid bitch thinking they own the town. making everyone's life miserable.
they don't make men like this anymore... “
You see, Worf, I’m not disagreeing with your ideas and I actually despise war, but my enormous study of human history
ReplyDeleteEnormous study ay?
Well you need to study a little harder.
Try the Roman Empire on for size sometime. Then we can talk about the BC wars (prior to Anno Domini).
We have evolved, but there's still enough of the throwback genes left, you two clowns being visible evidence of that..
But change will come. The Neanderthal eventually went extinct. So will you.
Yes, Worf, I'm very aware of the Roman Empire and its atrocities.......always a fascinating read!
ReplyDeleteBut here is something a little more modern:
http://www.popscreen.com/v/1iT1/Five-people-suspected-of-witchcraft-burnt-alive-in-Kenya
Please....not for youngsters or Lydia. Intelligent debaters only!!
Comparing undeveloped tribes and populations in undeveloped countries to modern civilizations doesn't augment your argument.
ReplyDeleteNor does singling out anecdotal stories trying to leverage their shock value.
Trust me, were this ancient Rome, you and I would no doubt be Saturday afternoon fodder for the enjoyment of the vulgar mob.
You'd no doubt be stomped to death by Flavius Asskickius in the arena, and me impaled on a stake and covered with tar and ignited to illuminate one of Nero's garden parties.
"You'd no doubt be stomped to death by Flavius Asskickius in the arena, and me impaled on a stake and covered with tar and ignited to illuminate one of Nero's garden parties."
ReplyDeleteOMG, I was just about to say the same thing!!!
Here are some of my very old history notes..... word for word:
- 64 A.D. Nero blames Christians for great fire that destroys Rome. Many Christians were crucified. Thousands of approving citizens watched as others were mangled by packs of dogs. Children & the elderly were torn to pieces by tigers in open theaters.Christians were smeared with tar then set ablaze to throw light on nightime chariot races.
And you don't have to go that far back.
ReplyDeleteYou talk about killing "5".
Isabella, who commissioned the voyages that led the discovery of our continent beheaded 5 THOUSAND in ONE DAY for heresy.
Mankind has evolved with regards to war and violence and anyone who knows anything about ancient history knows this well known fact.
Mankind has evolved, and will continue to evolve both as a people and a species.
Even you perhaps, if you'd get out of your own way.
Speaking of being impaled, a lot of people throw that word around. Does anyone here know the actual process as used by good ole Vlad?
ReplyDeleteHe used two poles one higher than the other. The second or lower pole was tapered and was rounded at the apex not pointed.
Both poles were greased, and the victims were stripped naked and their arms bound around the higher pole.
They were then sat on the lower tapered pole with the rounded top.
It was their own body weight that slowly forced the pole into their rectum and up through their bowels.
The entire process could take many days or even a week or two with the men moaning in agony.
A trick he learned from his former captors the muslims, and used on them when they tried to invade Romania only on a much larger scale...
Okay,Worf, I would be lying if I didn't say that we haven't evolved significantly barbaric wise. Ive actually made this point recently myself.
ReplyDeleteNevertheless, while we may have improved our methods of extermination mankind has changed little violence wise.
Anyways,I'm like total toast and must hit the hay.
Good night.
Flavius Odorous said..
ReplyDeleteDoes anyone here know the actual process as used by good ole Vlad?
Nero used that method more than a thousand years before old Dracula did his schtick (get it? "schtick"), and long before the Muslims even existed.
Some he'd let dangle for days, but often he'd also cover the victim in tar then light them on fire to illuminate his gardens at night.
He found Christians burned the brightest.
Johnny Skywalker said...
ReplyDeleteOkay,Worf, I would be lying if I didn't say that we haven't evolved significantly barbaric wise. Ive actually made this point recently myself.
Congratulations Luke. You've just taken your first step into a larger world.
Nevertheless, while we may have improved our methods of extermination mankind has changed little violence wise.
ReplyDeleteCondolences Luke. You've just taken your first step back to your old world.
- Obi Wan Baloney
The truth is and history confirms that a lot has changed, both quantitatively and with regards to frequency.
Please read the new post on nuns. GO NUNS!!
ReplyDeleteI was literally lifted out of suicidal despair, and transformed in a series of full-blown miracles.
PLEASE leave your comment on that lady's VIOLENT ALL-CAPS comment here, but first read the article. NO TAXES HAVE EVER BEEN ALLOWED TO BE USED FOR ABORTION!!!:
ReplyDeletehttp://politicallyhot.blogspot.com/