Saturday, February 04, 2006


Can you believe we live in such paranoid times that we have to suspect spies and hackers! Thanks Mr. President.

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Americans need desperately to understand that 95 percent of all Muslim terrorists in the world were created in the past three years by Bush's invasion of Iraq. (Paul Craig Roberts

When making such an ominous decision as whether to commit young lives to war, great men question the validity of their thoughts, do not arrogantly claim they are talking to God (as Bush did.) They do not refuse to deeply weigh the consequences, the "exit strategy", the repurcussions, the enemy's wrath, the clergy's advice, the Pandora's box. Wise men do not skew the evidence, lie to the people, rush to war and claim victory before the pullout. Who in his right mind would trust this man? And you wonder why we don't trust him when he says he's only spying on international calls to Al Queda? If we had faith in him to care about the common man, the common good, we'd be on his side. I have a feeling his team wants this information to formulate a strategy -- to find out where their base is, to ostracize certain people and find out their reading/buying/voting/ habits. To maybe prevent whole communities from voting -- or even worse.

Silence is complicity. That's the reason I have to speak out, though I know that real power is in not fearing them, but somehow forgiving their weaknesses and transforming my thought about them, so I don't help create the very situations I most fear. In Christ's time, people had the same fears about government, the Pharisees. The world always feels like it's ending; but somehow the human spirit survives. That's our job.

Nothing makes sense anymore, so I may as well offer an alternative version. Here’s how I see it: it’s normal and natural to be a left-winger or Democrat and believe in Christ. In fact, "pro-war, conservative Christian" doesn't make sense; it's an oxymoron. Again, the religious right-wing so-called "Christians" are involved in the most dangerous perversion of Christianity I've ever seen. Jesus was the Prince of Peace. His entire ministry was spent caring for the poor, the lepers (todays Aids victims), the immoral "sinners", the prisoners, the downtrodden whom the religious leaders thought were too dirty to touch. By giving them love and compassion, they became whole. Whether Christian or not, it's our job as a society to care for the poor, the "least among us." People everywhere hunger for the love that passes all understanding, that heals human suffering. Liberal is a beautiful word: it means "generous, bounteous, freedom-giving". Liberals care about the things that really matter: the poor, the middle class, education, crime-prevention, the environment, peace, harmony, prosperity, diplomacy. Liberals are not "baby-killers" or" traitors" just because Ann Coulter says so. She uses the "language of extermination" and conveniently says she's "joking". Enlighten me; I don't get the joke. I don't get what's funny about an elderly Justice dying from ingesting rat-poison, do you? Coulter makes a living selling hate.

It’s okay to be bewildered at times with the ACLU, hate abortion and still be a Democrat. No one is pro-abortion. Under Clinton, the abortion rate dropped; it rose dramatically under Bush. How can you outlaw abortion? By assigning a police-watchdog to hover over every girl or woman and test them to see if they're pregnant. Then follow them around day and night to make sure they don't grab a coat-hanger or have a "back-alley" abortion which may kill them. That's all Democrats want to prevent: more needless deaths. Because history shows that unprotected sex will happen, and some women will try to get rid of it themselves. If you want to guard against this, have a Gestapo agent hold the woman down for 9 months to force her to have a baby. The guard will also have to force her to take Folic acid and to never put a chemical in her body that could hurt the fetus (junk food, caffeine, liquor). You can't stop people from smoking or damaging their own bodies. We know smoking kills. Why do we legalize smoking?

It’s okay to be offended by porn and still be a democrat who believes in free speech. Real women don't like being objectified by men's magazines and Howard Stern, and don’t think the F-word is representative of free speech. Dumb blondes are not always dumb; they are a persecuted minority and should have minority status -- so they deserve Affirmative Action. I hope you know that’s a joke.

Did you know that we have 1 million MORE hungry, poverty-striken American children than we did six years ago? According to the US Census Bureau, 35.9 million people live below the poverty line in America including 12.9 million children. (

Did you know that Dell Computers just outsourced 5,000 new jobs to India, with 10,000 already there? Did you know that Ford just cut 30,000 jobs? The STATE OF THE UNION address, showed us a president with no vision, no specifics, and no effort to discuss how he's going to pay for the endless war -- or draft soldiers to fight it once all our men are gone; how he's going to pay for Katrina & levee rebuilding, or how he's going to help the poor, middle classes and elderly afford health care. Oh yeah, I forgot -- by making them put whatever extra money they have in "medical bank accounts" that Citibank or some other Bush friend can "borrow" from to create a portfolio that will amass over 75 billion by 2010. As if the poor or the middle classes have any extra money.

The Democratic Party, at its best, is light years ahead of the Republican party in the things that really matter to Americans. I have great hope for the future, because we know we have good on our side. It's truth, love & kindness and you know it in your heart. It's our job as citizens of the earth to take care of "the least among us." You will know good people by what they produce. This house of cards will fall, you'll see. Benjamin Franklin said something to the effect that "you cannot trade liberty for security or you will end up with neither."


1.From Harding In 1921 to Bush in 2003

2.Democrats held White House for 40 years and Republicans for 42.5 years.

3.Democrats created 75,820,000 net new jobs -- Republicans 36,440,000.

4.Per Year Average—Democrats 1,825,200---Republicans 856,400.

5.Republicans had 9 presidents during the period and 6 had depression or recession.

6.Republicans had a recession/depression in 177 months and Democrats in 32 months. 

7.DOW—grew by 52% more under Democrats.

8.GDP—grew by 43% more under Democrats. 
Comparing Democrat’s hero-CLINTON—versus Republican’s hero--REAGAN
1.JOBS—grew by 43% more under Clinton.

2.GDP---grew by 57% more under Clinton.

3.DOW—grew by 700% more under Clinton..

4.NASDAQ-grew by 18 times as much under Clinton.

4.SPENDING--grew by 28% under Clinton---80% under Reagan.

5.DEBT—grew by 43% under Clinton—187% under Reagan.
6. DEFICITS—Clinton got a large surplus--grew by 112% under Reagan.

7.NATIONAL INCOME—grew by100% more under Clinton.

8.PERSONAL INCOME—Grew by 110% more under Clinton.

SOURCES—Bureau of Labor Statistics (www.BLS.Gov)--Economic Policy Institute (—Global & World Almanacs from 1980 to 2003 (annual issues) (chart taken from NY Times) National Archives History on Presidents. Clarence Swinney-Political Historian Please submit comments to or P.O. Box 3411-Burlington NC-27216

I suddenly snapped back to reality and realized I had been spiraling down into fear by paying too much attention to all the negative news: the gossipy alarmist politics, the backstabbing and fear-mongering. Reality is the opposite of what we think it is. The true substance of life is the underlying beauty, the harmonious structure beneath the chaos. I was in my son's room doing yoga yesterday, on my back, and I looked up and saw a perfect rainbow on the ceiling. It all became clear that harmony, love and beauty are the fabric of reality just beneath the surface. Remember there was a time we thought the earth was flat because we trusted only our eyes? Our physical senses betray us. As Shakespeare and Christ and every great force ultimately came to express: "there is nothing either good or bad, but thinking makes it so." So we better keep our thoughts on the good in life because our thoughts create our reality. What you focus on GROWS. Whatever you think about all day long, is what you create, so it's important to elevate your thoughts to gratitude, love, beauty, truth, life. What we dwell on transforms us.

"Right reaction" is the supreme art of life, and Jesus compressed the secret of that art into a sentence when he said "Resist not evil" (This means: DON'T FIGHT ANYTHING) Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you and persecute you. Heaven, by the way, is a state of mind, not a physical place. You create your own heaven or hell depending on the thoughts you hold.

Emmet Fox put it beautifully in his famous essay on LOVE:

There is no difficulty that enough love will not conquer;
no disease that enough love will not heal;
no door that enough love will not open;
no gulf that enough love will not bridge;
no wall that enough love will not throw down;
no sin that enough love will not redeem . . .

It makes no difference how deeply seated may be the trouble;
how hopeless the outlook;
how muddled the tangle;
how great the mistake.
A sufficient realization of love will dissolve it all.
If only you could love enough you would be the happiest and most powerful being in the world . . .

The art of life is to live in the present moment, and to make that moment as perfect as we can by the realization that we are the instruments and expression of God (Love) Itself. Emmet Fox

In answer to a commenter named "Voltaire" who argued that Bush had a right to circumvent the FISA law because times and technology have changed since cell phones and electronic devices are now in use. He does have a point here, but there is something more important. I said he was using style over substance, that "the principle that the law is based on never changes."

Voltaire then mocked me with this, juxtaposing my own answers: Lydia said: "Principle never changes"/ "Bush is proud of himself for never changing his mind..."


And I also said this: Principle never changes. Going to war is not "a principle." Being stubborn is not a "principle", does not connote good (Godly) principes.
Dictionary definition of Principle: "A basic truth, law, or assumption: the principles of democracy. A rule or standard, especially of good behavior."

Goodness, truth and beauty are actual laws (principles) of the universe, according to Einstein - wihch is why I believe he was on the verge of proving "God" (love) through his unified field theory.

Tonight I was in the kitchen making dinner for my boys, and I turned on the radio to KABC the Al Rantell show and heard this: "Tonight I have a special surprise guest, Ann Coulter." I was thinking about Coulter's remark last week at Philander Smith College where she got paid $20,000 to say this: "We need somebody to put rat poisoning in Justice Stevens' creme brulee," Coulter said. "That's just a joke, for you in the media." Suddenly I hear Al Rantell treating Coulter like royalty and laughing hysterically over "creme brulee" as some inside joke. He says to his listeners, "you have to be up on the news to know what we're laughing about." Then Al asks Coulter her expert intellectual opinion on the Cindy Sheehan debacle, and they both start putting Sheehan down like she's a criminal, rather than deeply talking about this from a new angle, trying to get inside the story. They parrot what CNN falsely claimed, assuming that Sheehan was there to make a scene. Then Coulter in her inimitable sarcasm says that this was "the President's show, his day where he gets to shine and Sheehan was obviously there just to upset him. Then I hear Al Rantell say, "Too bad liberals say such horrible, tasteless things, they say things Nazis would say... and Coulter chimes in, "and their jokes aren't even funny."

At this point my nerves are on edge and I'm so horrified (had nightmares after the State of the Union address, so didn't get much sleep) so I call Brad Friedman of BRAD BLOG who was the first of anyone in the mainstream or alternative media to break the Cindy Sheehan story last night - and Brad says, "Lydia you have to call in to Al Rantell and get on the air and challenge him!" I said okay, but meant "no way". Don't know why I was so nervous; I did 12 radio shows in one week after my Brad Blog article Death is Sexier than Sex broke but this time, I was "just a caller". So I thrashed through my fear and called. And guess who was already on the air confronting Al Rantell with all the lies he was spewing about Cindy Sheehan? Brad. He was magnificent, as usual: that guy is the most calm, rational, amazing voice of reason for our side, and he had Al agreeing with him about the treatment of Sheehan. Then they put me on the line - and I said, "How do you think the world views Bush talking about "freedom" while a mother who lost her son for the cause of freedom is handcuffed and marched out of her own Capitol building for wearing the number of our dead soldiers on her black shirt? Some freedom." After he said some things about the president visiting with Sheehan after Casey died, I finally got to what I really wanted to say, "Al, you let Ann Coulter get away with 'extermination-speak' and laughed about it. I'm writing a book on Ann Coulter with a conservative Christian, Dan Borchers, and I'm a liberal Democrat Christian..." to which Rantell acted shocked, "A liberal Democrat Christian!?" "Yes," I said (I should have said I'm a Democrat BECAUSE I'm a Christian as Rebecca Miller said, a woman from Ponca City, Oklahoma who left me the most wonderful message after Ann Coulter published my home number on her website, which is still up there, by the way after numerous requests to take it down.) Anyway, I went on, "Al, you were laughing with Coulter, does this mean you condone what she said about wanting to put rat poison in Justice Steven's creme brulee...and Rantell talked over me and said, "She said she was just joking..." "Yes', I said, "I know she said she was "joking" but what's so funny about an elderly Supreme Court Justice ingesting rat poison and dying? Where's the joke...?" Then Al went on to say, "What about that black lady, that black woman what's her name -- who advocated a senator dying of too much butter and cholesterol..: And I said, "That's appalling of course, but Coulter who wears a cross and claims to be a Christian...." CLICK. They hung up on me for the news. I wish I had said, "Did you invite that woman on your show and honor her hate-speak as an inside-joke with laughter? Wait a minute, now I realize he was talking about Julianne Malveaux and a comment she made to Clarence Thomas over 7 years ago! Is that the best he could come up with?

Letter from an Iraq War Vet to the chairman of Bucks County Young Republicans.

I called you to get some sort of understanding on the reason why you were upset that the Bucks County Democratic Headquarters has posted the death count of US Troops in Iraq outside their office. You had explained to me that you feel the local Democrats are trying to play politics on the issue of the Iraq war. They say they are just trying to honor our fallen troops.

I agree with you that Democrats voted right along side of Republicans to give President Bush the authority to invade Iraq. That is an undisputed fact. But in the end it was the decision of the President to
take us to war. As a veteran of that war I don't feel that it is wrong to let the public know that troops are dying every day in Iraq. It's not politics it's just plain reality.

This morning you told me that out of your whole organization (Bucks County Young Republicans) only two or three members plan to pursue military service. And at the same time you told me that your organization supports the war in Iraq. If your organization is so supportive of the war maybe more than two or three of your members should volunteer for military service. Believe me those troops in Iraq could use a little extra help. We have soldiers right now that are on their third tour of duty.

When I got home from Iraq after a year long combat tour I attended a Kerry/Edwards rally in Kansas City. At the rally I was confronted by a group of able-bodied males carrying signs that said "Students For Bush." They called me a traitor, a disgrace, and they told me to move to France. They said this because I was going to vote for Senator Kerry. They claim to be so supportive of the troops, but they were not at all supportive of me. I guess that only applies to troops who share their political ideas. I just returned home from a war that they support, but obviously don't have the courage to fight. If they did
they would be fighting it. It is much easier to support a war from your office, classroom, or from your cozy living room than from the actual battlefield.

I served with plenty of troops who are pro-Bush and pro-Iraq war. For the most part they were the majority. I had respect for them despiteour disagreements because those troops put their money where their mouth is. They have definitely earned their right to an opinion. Just as I have earned mine.

About a year ago I contacted an old friend of mine who belongs to the Philadelphia Young Republicans. I asked him how many in his group had served. He replied that he thinks that one of them served in Kosovo back in the late 90s. It seems like there is a lot of "false patriotism" going around these days. The hefty amount of "flag waving" and "chest beating" is not balancing out the low recruitment levels.

The purpose of this email is not to be confrontational or attack the Republican Party. I don't want people to misunderstand me. My motives are to try and educate as many people as I can about the reality of the situation in Iraq.

I am a strong supporter and advocate of Congressman John Murtha's resolution. My experience in Iraq has made me a critic of the war. At this point in time I feel that the US Military has done everything that can possibly be done in Iraq. The time has come to bring our troops home. Especially now that it has been established that every reason we went there never existed. And the Bush administration has conceded that as well. So why should more troops continue to die? I can't think of
one logical answer or reason.

Respectfully, John Bruhns
Iraq War Veteran

From the Comment section: False Patriotism? Try False Everything. Republican "warriors" have always sent others to die for their causes. Their SOP is to socialize costs while privatizing benefits. In the case of war, promoters are usually the beneficiaries while others pay the true costs. I wonder how many of those Young Republicans even visit the permanently maimed soldiers that lay in beds at the VA hospitals. Very few, I expect.
(Letter and comment Reprinted from Adam McKay at HUFFPO)


  1. Anonymous11:28 PM

    God bless Cindy's son but she's a usefull idiot.

  2. BTW Lydia, I forgot to say congradulations for the Koufax award nomination, you really started something great, theres a fantastic group of people with lots of interesting points of view and great things to say, and I really enjoy coming here .

    Also your absolutely right as i've said in a previous post there is most definately a lack of vision in the Bush Administration, while the outsourcing trend has been going on for quite a while and is not completely Bush's fault there is clearly a lack of vision and desire to protect middle class jobs. General Motors also announced 30,000 lay offs, these are good paying middle class jobs that wont be replaced. It looks to me like this administration is focussed on the war and nothing else, it really seems like they could care less about the shrinking middle class or the hurricaine victims its all just tunnel vision on the IRAQ war and spying on Americans.

  3. Anonymous11:54 PM

    Read the post about the Young Republicans that Lydia just posted. They all angrily get in Dems faces about patriotism and supporting the war, but not a single one of them is enlisted to fight or help the cause. Sickening hypocrites.

    How many Republicans do you think have children fighting in Iraq?

    When the draft is instituted, do you think the war will end?

  4. Anonymous7:05 AM

    Cindy Sheehan was wearing a black shirt with the numbers: 2, 240...or something.


  5. Cindy Sheehan is THE ONLY person in America today that is in the same league with Gandhi. As far as I can tell, she has been peacefully resisting to make her point and somehow she manages to be the only one to scare the SH%% out of our establishment.......she may have something going.

  6. The Constitution should be amended as follows........No war shall be engaged without first enlisting EVERY able bodied first and second degree relative of EACH member of Congress, The Senate, the Cabinet, and the Oval Office (Pres and VP), and placing them on the front line of said war.

    Personally, if I were in the house I'd have had no problem going to Afghanistan to find OBL with my brothers, sons, cousins etc. Iraq is a little different story.....

  7. Worfeus said "Funny, if he was really trying to help the Dems, as the right will claim, then why would he take points that clearly are going to draw fire and give the right a reason to say the Dems favor terrorists etc?"

    Worfeus was refering to Zawahri's quote from a video released a few days ago, whats sad is that as riddiculous as it sounds, he's right, isnt it sad that these right wing liars can claim democrats actually favor terrorists or are in league with them, I mean think how UTTERLY RIDDICULOUS that sounds and yet a fair portion of the nation actually believes these liars and deceivers. It reminds me of the Mcarthy era witch hunts where everyone who didnt agree with you or was a political rival was accused of being a Communist. Its really pretty sad that we havent evolved that much from the Salem Witch Trials.

  8. James W8:35 AM

    WEll said LYDIA: FUNNY how Bush talked about "Freedom" and then, at that moment, handcuffed Cindy Sheehan for wearing the number of our dead soldiers or a stop sign on her black shirt. Some freedom. How, may I asked, is Ms Sheehan's action disrespectful and criminal? What is inappropriate about someone like Cindy Sheehan quietly honoring and remembering our loved ones, killed in the US/Iraq War, during the President's State of the Union address. How more poignant, appropriate, and timely could this message be upon Ms. Sheehan's upper torso? Isn't this, in fact, the best arena and time to honor those whose lives were lost through their patriotic duty? What is criminal about honoring the dead who gave their lives in the name of this country - who gave their lives for a noble cause, according to our president, so that others will know and share in this same cherished state of democracy and freedom as we, in these United States, are so fortunate to know.

  9. It is horrible that she was arrested outside of the steps of the capital because the little pug nosed thick headed republican COWARDS did not like her T-Shirt.

    This is about as SICK, and TWISTED and COWARDLY a REPUGNICAN act as I could imagine.

    These guys are lower than scum, worse than traitors, and are the evil that corrupts this world.

    Arresting a mom who lost her son is going to be at the top of the list that sends these pompous, arrogant fools and traitors right down to the hell they deserve.

    I may not agree with everything Cindy Sheehan says or does, but by God this is America, and she has a right to say it.

    Repugnicans who endorse this arrest are filth, vermin as far as I can tell, either Evil or the followers of Evil.

    God may forgive them for their cowardly foolish and vile wickedness, but I never will.

  10. Welcome to Nazi freakin Germany, cause we are arresting disenters and showing the world our paranoid silencing of the opposition.

    Seig freakin Heil.

  11. ChristianWarrior10:37 AM

    This the MOST VILE display of hypocrisy I've ever seen in our government. Bush is mentally ill, sick and needs to be taken away to a funny farm.

    Imagine how Jesus Christ would deal with Cindy Sheehan, Imagine how a great leader would deal with any dissent, especially a grief-striken mother who has done nothing but ask for a straight answer and try to prevent others from dying needlessly.

    All Bush had to do was look her in the eye with the utmost compassion and say he was sorry for her son's death. All he has to do is say he's sorry for his his miscalculations. And ask forgiveness and then ask for help in finding solutions to this apocalyptic quagmire.

    If Cindy Sheehan looked like Pamela Anderson would she get more sympathy or at least answers?

  12. Anonymous11:46 AM

    If Cindy Sheehan looked like Pamela Anderson would she get more sympathy or answers?

  13. great post James, you made some excellent points, it was absolutely disgraceful how Bush can talk about freedom and then have someone arrested for exercising their freedom and civil liberties this just goes back to what I said on the previous blog how he talks out of both sides of his mouth and NOBODY calls him on it, he is one of the biggest hippocrites i've ever seen. Last I checked freedom of speech and the right to dissent were not illegal, I guess if you dont agree with him or if he doesnt agree with you it IS ILLEGAL, but just give Bush more time, right now he's working on destroying our 4th Amendment rights, soon he'll take away other freedoms as well all for our own good of course and to keep us safe GAG GAG!!

    Worfeus Said "Welcome to Nazi freakin Germany, cause we are arresting disenters and showing the world our paranoid silencing of the opposition."

    Didnt I say in the previous blog that political enemies and dissenters would start getting arrested,(you just said it in a much shorter more concise way), theres a bunch of warning signs when a power grab is going on and people who speak out getting arrested means we are moving to the later more dangerous stages, and you are right, it is starting to look more like Nazi Germany.

  14. I have to admit I've been "luke-warm" on Cindy Sheehan up till now. I think it's unreasonable to think we can just up and leave Iraq. I also think we never should have gone there in the first place, but having said that we shouldn't have gone in there without enough troops to actually "nation-build".

    While I continue to disagree with Cindy on what we should do about this mess I certainly am vehemently opposed to what happened to her last night.

    But matter.....I am free



  15. James W2:27 PM

    Mike, thank you but Lydia said that post I was just cutting and pasting from her blog. Yes it is a good point how Bush talks about "freedom" while arresting a meek little woman in a free country for wearing clothing that scared him. And let's say their worst fears came true and Cindy shouted something or interrupted him: just once I'd like to see him act like a human being, without a script. Let him be shocked and have to answer her from his heart. That would have been a history-making SOTU.

  16. Well I mean really.

    What the hell kind of psychopathic nutcase arrests the mother of a fallen solider on the steps of the nations Capital building???

    Particularly when she has an invitation in her hand to the State of The Union!

    Who cares if theres a dissenting voice in the crowd?


    Whats ONE LITTLE LADY who lost her son to the Presidents war, sitting there with an opposition T-Shirt On???

    Is the President made of Glass?

    What the hell are they afraid of?

    Has the right wing become of bunch of dirty little goosestepping PIGS arresting dissenters who get noticed?

    Did anyone see the picture of the fat peice of crap overseeing the arrest angrily staring at her and having her taken away?

    He had repugnican written all over him.

    Screw them. And Screw the LILY LIVERED DEMOCRATS who sit idly by saying mealy mouth crap like we need change or wer'e headed in the wrong direction.

    Bunch of wimps.

    I've got news for them.

    That horse has already left the barn.

  17. Anonymous2:29 PM

    I'm with ya Kirk, good points


  18. Where the hell was Howard Dean last night and what the hell was Tim Caine doing giving the Democratic response?

    The head of the Republican Party, the President gave a speech.

    The head of the Democratic Party, the DNC Chairman Howard Dean, should have offered the Democratic response!!!

    This is why the DEMS SUCK!

    And this is why they fail.

    What a stupid idea, putting up a high pitched softspoken, almost effeminate middle of the road little known Democrat to offer a half baked response to the Presidents speech.

    I don't know who I'm madder at right now.

    The facists, who at least have the gnads to act like facists, or the Democrats, who act like a bunch of parisitical leeches taking whatever scraps the repugs want to throw to them.

    One things for sure, they're both off my Christmas list.

  19. Anonymous2:37 PM

    I think this kind of stuff is only the tip of the iceberg


  20. Anonymous2:41 PM

    The Dems have to get their act together and call this guy on all the rhetoric, double talk and attrocities being committed for the public good.

    How does that saying go, "All evil needs to prosper is for good men to do nothing"


  21. Problem is too many people are just rallying around the Democrats because they are the only party big enough to win the election, unless all of America suddenly says like I think I'm gonna do in 08, and vote for Nader.

    If the Democrats would UNIFY BEHIND their LEADER, Howard Dean, they could easily win.

    But they all have their own agendas, they all want to be Pres, and Hillary wants to be the first women President.

    We need people of Character, like Howard Dean, and Paul Hackett, men who speak their minds, and don't hold back.

    We have all the Liebermans and Daschle types we need.

  22. Anonymous2:43 PM

    Too bad old Slick WIllie Clinton couldnt run again, i'd vote for him in a minute


  23. I'd vote for Mr. Clinton too. Only because I know he's so freakin smart he would figure a way out of this mess. He'd make peace with the world and go after the terrorists.

    But Mrs. Clinton is not Bill. She has her own agenda and that agenda does not include you and me I wager.

    Just blindly following whatever and whomever the Dems throw out is no better than the repubs blindly following their little emperor.

    Don't want to run from a Lion right into a Leopard.

  24. Anonymous2:51 PM

    I agree with you, in that I dont care for hillary or Lieberman and other varios dems either, but at this point i'd take ANYTHING over what we got. Anything is better than a bunch of arrogant facist elitists


  25. Problem is Mike, you just spelled out the Dems byline.

    Anythings better than Bush we tried last time.

    I did not want Kerry, I wanted Dean. I voted for Kerry to try and beat Bush.

    I had mixed feelings about it at the time. Now I have none. If the Dems want the vote, then the Dems need to get behind thier leader Howard Dean, and start talking with a unified voice, like the republicans do.

    If they do that, guys like me will be on board.

    If they don't then I imagine Ralph Nader will see his best year yet.

  26. What happened to Cindy Sheehan last night was appalling and frightening.

    If Bush was a decent man, he would have said let her alone. She's paid enough. She's not hurting anyone.

    Can you imagine what an act like that could have done for Bush?

    But they goosestepped her off to jail like a criminal cause she dared to exercise her constitutional right to free and open protest of her own government in of all places, the US Capital.

    It is critical to understand they could have just removed her if they were that afraid of a little lady in a T Shirt, instead of arresting her.

    But instead they chose to arrest her like the gestapo or KGB or something, hauling her away while the ghost of her dead soldier son watched on from the steps of the Capital.

    This was an act of PURE COWARDICE AND EVIL.

    Anyone who does not have a huge problem with this is no American, and no Patriot.

  27. Worf/Mike/ Kirk/James

    I cannot, in this case, tell anyone to "Stay Frosty" regarding the Sheehan situation; this is truly stomach churning.

    My powers of observation are quite inadequate to describe the immoral, and pathetic sadness of this injustice towards a grieving mother.

    I have listened patiently to conservative thoughts and wisdoms, and have even agreed with them on several occasions, however, this Sheehan thing goes far beyond my scope of reasoning.

    Im almost ready to stop being a moderate.... which defies the very fibre of my being.

    Associated Press Writer
    10 minutes ago

    WASHINGTON - Capitol Police dropped a charge of unlawful conduct against anti-war activist Cindy Sheehan on Wednesday and apologized for ejecting her and a congressman's wife from President Bush's State of the Union address for wearing T-shirts with war messages.

    "The officers made a good faith, but mistaken effort to enforce an old unwritten interpretation of the prohibitions about demonstrating in the Capitol," Capitol Police Chief Terrance Gainer said in a statement late Wednesday.

    "The policy and procedures were too vague," he added. "The failure to adequately prepare the officers is mine."

  29. So we now learn they did not even have legal grounds to arrest her?

    Well at least they apologized... :|

  30. So we are to assume some low level Capital police officer made a call he has never made before?

    Made a call on a law that was "unwritten" but he apparently knew enough about it to march into the Capital during the State of the Union address, to arrest a mother who lost a son in Iraq, and the rest of the cops followed suit?

    Hmmm, guess I could buy that. If I were a brainwashed idiot like the rest of the sheep.

    I will wager that the order to arrest came from a lot higher than these clowns, but either way it was a sick act, and apologizing for it after the fact is bs.

    They broke the law, and I hope she sues.

  31. "The officers made a good faith, but mistaken effort to enforce an old unwritten interpretation of the prohibitions about demonstrating in the Capitol," Capitol Police Chief Terrance Gainer said.

    In a PIGS EYE.

  32. Anonymous4:20 PM

    Come on Worf, get with the program, dont you realize that the president cant break the law, he is omnipotent, his word is law, and he has our best interests a heart and is only trying to protect us, who knows what kind of horrible things would have happened if the public saw Sheehan's shirt. :D

    seriously thats par for the course to blame the mistake on the hired help, yeah those storm troopers were out of control, thats garbage, they knew exactly what they were doing, they were following orders. and as for apologizing after the fact thats par for course too, just like they went to war in Iraq on MISIMFORMATION, now they are doing everything in their power to justify it. last night they attemped to circumvent the 1st Amendment as well as the 4Th.Disgraceful is all I can say.


  33. I agree Mike.

    I'm so mad I'm shaking.

    What a dirty thing to do! They even marched the Congressmens wife out of his own Capital.

    Might I remind people that the President is only a GUEST in the Capital. The Capital belongs to Congress, not the Pres, and it is supposed to be a symbol of our freedom.

    And the freedom to protest openly ones own government is our first official right granted in the Bill of Rights!

    How can this happen?

  34. Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press, or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.

    The First Ammendment of the Constitution of the United States

  35. Anonymous4:31 PM

    The President doesnt have legal grounds for spying on Americans, but he hasnt let that stop him, why should this be any different, once you trample on people's rights it just keeps getting easier and easier the more you do it, particularly when you keep putting more and more of "YOUR" people into positions of power.


  36. I'd say sitting quietly in your seat wearing a T-Shirt that shows an accurate number of the lives lost in Iraq as a way of protest, constitutes a peaceful protest.

    And people were certainly assembled. It was the assembly.

    So why was this Americans right to protest stifled???

    Anyone ok with this is NO AMERICAN.

  37. I know Mike, and I understand you are probably a Democrat and it bothers you that I don't completely support the Dems.

    But tough love is the only love I know.

  38. The reason the Democrats won't get behind Dean is because there is corruption deep seated there as well.

    They don't want certain things to change, and they don't want to alienate those on the right who may have something on them.

    There are lots of reasons the Dems won't rally behind their leader, but I can't think of one GOOD one.

  39. Anonymous4:44 PM

    Doesnt bother me a bit Worf, in fact in 2000 I voted for Nader because I wasnt crazy about either candidate, but at this point i'd vote for a chimpanzee if it ran against Bush, I dont blindly support anyone, and I realize the Dems have their problems but they are better than the alternative.


  40. Worfeus said

    " Im so mad, Im shaking!"

    May I now suggest Worf, that you do stay frosty.

    Remember, theres power in remaining in control of oneself.

  41. Thank you Mr. Anderson :|

    Now pay your taxes and help your landlady carry out her garbage.. :D

  42. Your a good JOE Worf :O

  43. I'm a dead Joe.

    If it weren't for the fact that you can bleed to death in under 5 minutes from a cut to a non vital area of your body from a knife, then I'd still be alive today.

  44. Mike said;

    but at this point i'd vote for a chimpanzee if it ran against Bush

    Might as well Mike. We've got a bunch of Apes running the place now.

  45. The only good human, is a dead human!

    George "dubya" Bush

  46. Sorry, I'll stop monkeying around.

  47. Anonymous5:33 PM

    Worfeus said "Has the right wing become of bunch of dirty little goosestepping PIGS arresting dissenters who get noticed?"

    in a word YESSSSSS!!!!!!

    I've been saying this was coming over and over in the previous blog, and I think this is only the beginning, only the tip of the iceberg so to speak. And just think Bush was trying to be all warm and fuzzy in this speech, he was trying to say both parties should work together and he even did an about face and said we need to start pursuing an alternate energy policy like the Dems have been saying, then he had a woman who's son died fighting for our country because he didnt like her t-shirt. So much for the kinder gentler Bush, the mask came off and he showed his true colors.


  48. Actually Worf, Im not so sure you are a ghost. Mike correctly pointed out that ghosts cant break their ankles in rabbit holes.

    I believe you may be faking this?

  49. Oh noo Neo,

    Big K said it so it must be true.

    He said that if you cut yourself with a knife, in a non-vital area of your body, that you would bleed to death in less than 5 minutes.

    So I'm dead now. And theres just no getting around that. :|

  50. I hope your wearing black.

  51. Well, Big K was wrong. He is not a bad guy. I suggest he just read some wrong information and statics.

    I always wear black Worf, as does Lil Miss moo moo, who has unjustly been labelled a Goth.

  52. Actually, she had a question for me regarding you - I said : " I dont know! Ask Worf yourself."

    Do you mind if she asks you later on?

  53. It would be my pleasure

  54. But if what you are saying is true, then I would not be dead.

    But unless Big K says so, then how can I believe?

    I mean the Right is suddenly the sole harbinger of all knowledge and anything liberals think is heretical treason.

    That would be something though, wouldn't it? I mean if Big K came in and kinda, "resurrected" me as it were.

    That would indeed be a miracle.

  55. She will be home after I pick her up within the hour.

  56. BIG K

    Might I, respectfuly request, that you resurrect the spirit of Worfeus and bring him back to the land of the living?

  57. I have no such powers Johnny....

    Only he whose words sent me to the dance with the reaper, can return me thence..

  58. But my spirit is always with you.

    So to speak.

  59. Ok.

    In the meantime, can I just say how nice it is of the police to help our veterans acclimatize to the culture shock of returning from combat in Iraq.

    I mean, wasn't it nice of that trooper to open up on that veteran who just got back?

    The smell of gunpowder and the smell of hot lead searing through flesh must have made that soldier feel right at home thanks to that cop.

    Our brave heros in blue helping our returning war heros adjust to civilian life. It makes me proud to be an American.

    You know, I heard they put the cop on paid administrative leave.

    Maybe they’ll give him a medal or something. :|

  60. Anonymous6:54 PM

    Hi worfeus. A couple of days ago when my dad was making his portfolio, I asked the silly question : "How come Worfeus doesn't have one?" Well, obviously dad couldn't answer this, so now, I am directing the awaited question to you. Sorry I couldn't offer you something more intelligent. If I have any further questions in the future, I'll be sure to ask you. Thanks. ;)


    Lil Miss Moo Moo

  61. Well I do have a profile sweetie, its just not very detailed. :D

    Lets just say if I lived in the free democratic republic of Canada, I may have included more details.

  62. Worf

    Lil Miss moo moo did ask me why you didnt put anything on your profile.

    I did remark that some people do prefer to keep private, however, she asked "Whats so private about indicating what books or movies someone likes?"

    I had no answer, except to say: Ask Worfeus yourself."

    If you feel the question is too personal, I will explain to her further?

  63. Anonymous7:58 PM

    Worfeus (sorry I didn't capitalize your name before) after I asked the question, I pondered whether or not the question was even a good one to ask. I hope no offense was taken. You are a highly intelligent scholar. Now that I think of it more, I could understand how someone would want to keep subjects such as movies, books, etc private. It was nice talking to you, but it's bed time for me.

    Guten Nacht

    Lil Miss Moo Moo

    P.S My dad told me to say hi to everyone else.

  64. Jeanie8:05 PM

    Lydia I heard you on Al Rantell's show tonight and I am so proud of you for standing up to Al about Ann Coulter! And what you said about Cindy Sheehan was great. But you should of said your last name.


  65. Is there anywhere we can hear this show online?

    I'd like to hear that.

  66. Nacht klein moo moo, schlafen Sie gut

    Oh und lassen Sie nicht den Bettwanzen Bissen

  67. I meant me too for your first post, I have no clue what you said in the second post

  68. Voltaire9:18 PM

    Dave Delp - Thrown out of Clinton's impeachment trial in congress for wearing a tee-shirt that said, "Clinton Doesn't Inhale - He Sucks."

  69. I don't agree with him being thrown out either, however there is a huge difference between being asked to leave the room and arresting, handcuffing and hauling off to jail a mother who lost her son in a Bush's war, not to mention inventing a charge to arrest her and then saying, oops, sorry.

    Leave her alone. Shes not hurting anyone. Damn facist bastards.

  70. It is completely different, i was going to respond to this post, but Worfeus allready said basically everything I was going to say, so i'll just say-

    What he said!!! :D

  71. Worf i'm a little clueless about Cindy Sheehan before yesterday's incident, was she the one who was protesting the war outside Bush's ranch in Texas and he came out and got in her face and said something like "i'm the President of the United States, you got something to say to me" like he was trying to intimidate her just like a big bully would. That really made me angry, he's such a dispicable person, instead of showing compassion or trying to see her perspective even though he didnt agree he acted like he was some kind of god and no one should dare question or oppose him, the arrogance from the Right Wing is just unreal.

  72. Voltaire10:11 PM

    I felt sorry for Cindy for awhile.

    Then I saw her use the sympathy she was given to collaborate with communists and coddle third world dictators. I saw where she and her group raised money for terrorists in Falujah. What do you think THEY did with that money? She tried to (and possibly did) scam the victims of Katrina.

    Her leader and organizer Medea Benjamin of "Code Pink" is a tried and true communist whose organized violent riots all over the world.

    Her son was a TRUE hero who enlisted TWICE, the second time AFTER the war in Iraq had already started.

    Put your ear to the ground, hear that whirring sound? That's him spinning in his grave.

    If you ACTUALLY think Bush is a dictator, what do you think they'll be like if they ever come to power?

    I wish you guys could have your world just the way you want it. Problem is the rest of us would have to live in it too, and by then it'd be too late to save any of us.

  73. Voltaire10:13 PM

    Mike, you're clueless about a lot of things it seems. Bush only met with her once right after her son died and she had nothing but nice things to say about the meeting...

  74. Well voltaire the world has been the way warmongering blithering idiots and blind sheep like your crowd have wanted it for thousands of years.

    I think were all ready for a change.

  75. But you guys keep slappin each other on the back and telling yourselves what masters of the universe you are.

    The time for honoring yourselves will soon be at an end.

  76. I admit when i'm clueless about a topic and dont try to act like a know it all, mr Voltaire, and BTW I never said Bush met with her outside his ranch, I asked if that was her or someone else. Maybe what you say about her is true and maybe its a bunch of garbage, but regardless there was no justification for arresting a woman because you dont like her shirt, that was plain dispicable.

    BTW right now we are living in your world, or what I would call the Right Wings sick and twisted utopia, I truely hope the shoe will be on the other foot and you will be living in our world someday, because I assure you it will be a better place. And if speaking out against tyranny and oppresion and wanting the world to be a better place makes me clueless in your eye's then I guess I'm proud to be clueless.

  77. Anonymous11:57 PM

    THANK YOU MIKE!! Great post.

  78. "Freedom of speech doesn't guarantee you the right to yell "FIRE" in a crowded theatre...." Oliver W Holmes

    "....nor does it give you the right to wear a shirt to the SOTU speech"..... Sam Alito and friends.

    Seriously....where is the line... is there a certain decorum to be followed in this case? Would she have the right to wear a shirt like that at a trial or would she be in contempt of court? I don't know...... but I have to believe she went into the capital to do something other than sit there quietly with her shirt on under her jacket......she would have waited for a camera to get on her and then went wild...... and is that against the law? I don't know either.

  79. Or is this a case like pornography....... I can't define what is and isn't acceptable, but I'll know it when I see it?

  80. Mike

    Your 10:40 PM post was perfect and I couldn't have said it better myself.

  81. Anonymous9:24 AM

    Kirk I believe wearing what ever shirt you want falls under freedom of speech, she had the right to wear what ever she wanted and to say what ever she wanted even at Lord Bush's State of The Union Address, now wether the media chooses to give her air time is another issue. The real issue though is The Bush administration is trampling on and running roughshod over our Civil Rights and personal freedoms and people have to stand up and start calling him on this stuff before its too late. Lets not forgot Bush and the rest of his arrogant administration are supposed to be civil servants who work FOR the people, From were I sit it looks more like they feel they our king or lord and master, and we are their loyal subjects or merely serfs and peasants.


  82. Lets just remind anonymous and any other brown shirts that the President is a GUEST at the capital. It's not his house, it belongs to Congress and the people.

    Cindy was not even asked to cover up her shirt, she was just taken out and arrested. She went quietly and without shouting any protests, so to say she was going to do something other than sit there with the shirt on is ignorant.

    She intended on sitting there quietly. Thats what she said, and I believe her.

    Shes just ONE LITTLE WOMEN for crying out loud.

    What are all the big brave right wing bullies so afraid of?

  83. Anonymous9:35 AM

    Exactly, not only is the President a guest at the capital, but he is there to serve the people, not vice versa, he needs to start acting like a human being and not a dictator, what I saw the other night, is something I would expect to see in Russia or Nazi Germany, not the United States were we are supposed to stand for freedom and tolerance of others views.


  84. We've seen a LOT of things over the last few years since the right took power, that look like something you'd see in Nazi Germany instead of America.

    Too bad the blind goosestepping sheep who follow this corrupt tyrant can't see it.

  85. But I do have to admit, that its nice of the Police to have this new transition program to help returning combat veterans deal with culture shock of returning home to civillian life.

    We saw a demonstration of it last night on the news, when the nice police men discharged his weapon into a returning soldier at point blank range.

    Its a nice program. Our police are indeed heros. Removing dangerous women from the capital, beating an unarmed man to the point of incurring spinal injuries, and giving returning soldiers live fire drills right into their bodies, I mean, we should all feel good to have such heroes protecting us.

    I feel safe and warm.

  86. Guys....I feel bad for Cindy Sheehan.... much more so for the loss of her son than any arrest she's had to endure since. But come on ... is the rhetoric here a little over the top?...... Nazi Germany? Come back and tell me about it after Kristallnacht occurs again. Her freedom of speech was taken away.....for a few hours maybe... and yes that is appalling, but she wasn't sent to the Gulag.

    Comparing Bush to Nixon is more appropriate, don't you think?

  87. Anonymous11:22 AM

    Kirk, I dont think comparing Bush to Nixon is an accurate comparison, sure Nixon had Watergate, but with the Bush Administration there is a long pattern of lying, deception, silencing and discrediting opposing points of view and trampling on the constitution and our civil liberties and when you look at the progressive pattern and where it might lead, it is much more ominous and disturbing than what Nixon did.


  88. No I don't.

    Throughout history as civilations approach a threshold of tyranny, middle of the road citizens have perpetuated the rise of that tyranny by defeating any real comparisons of the pitfalls that commonly destroy freedom and yoke the people under an irreversable dictatorship.

    The same pitfalls that pulled Germany under the shroud of tyranny are happening right here, right now in this country.

    And dismissing these lessons of history are a sure path down to hell. In fact, has it not been well said, that the road to hell is paved with good intentions?

  89. You know, over the Holocaust museum in DC is an inscription carved into the header stone over the doorway that reads "Lest we ever forget".

    Looks like we already have.

  90. Anonymous11:32 AM

    Maybe the Nazi comparisons do seem a little over the top, but remember this, Hitler did not just start killing people, he used many of the same tactics while seizing power, all the while claiming it was for the public good and then when he seized complete power and there was no one to oppose him, the mask came off and he did as he pleased. I'm sure the citizens of Germany never thought things would go that far either. Now i'm not envisioning concentration camps in America, but I can see people who hold opposing views getting arrested or even disapearing in the future, look at Sheehan, I think thats only the tip of the iceberg. If megalomaniacs like these guys arent stopped or at least held accountable they keep pushing the envelope more and more, and seizing more power until its too late.


  91. I guess my point is that I don't see it ever getting that far. People are raising holy hell about the illegal wire taps and I just don't see a day in the near future when Cindy Sheehan is arrested and not released within an hour or 2. I don't see her being accused of "supporting terror" or whatever and locked away without charges being filed or being allowed to see a lawyer.

    Having said that....I'm not about to call you guys paranoid idiots or anything like that because I think your concerns are very valid but I think the rhetoric isn't...but then again....... maybe the reason you're paranoid is because everyone is conspiring against you ;).....AND......


  92. Anonymous12:54 PM

    Kirk my point is the average citizen in Germany never thought things would get that far either, most reasonable people wouldnt, but when there are multiple warning flags and danger signs we have to be mindful. how does that quote go, "those who fail to remeber history are doomed to repeat it"

    Like Lydia said the frog wont jump out of the pot if you turn up the heat slowly, these guys are slowly seizing and consolidating their power and taking away and stomping on our personal freedoms and as long as they dont do anything too radical and keep doing it slowly they may keep getting away with it. Bush just put 2 of HIS people in the Supreme Court, think what will happen if one of his questionably legal policies is refered to the Supreme Court for them to decide on the legality of it and the Supreme Court is in his pocket, now think where things can go from here if all the checks and balances are removed who is this guy accountable to, If he controls the executive, judicicial and legislative branches??/


  93. Kirk you are forgetting that on the mainstream news media that reaches most of America in their homes at night -- NONE of the things we are talking about are getting out there. One radio station Air America against 650 right-wing stattions owned by wing-nuts spewing propaganda against anyone who doesn't buy their party line -- this is a media monopoly. Only Keith Olberman, who is very funny, and only a couple of low key commentators are allowed on all the major networks, with virtually no one talking about the truth, the real truth. HEALTH CARE IN AMERICA and POVERTY has reached a crisis point. Also did you know that Bush just put out a 40 billion tax cut for guess what? Education, children's programs for gang prevention, Medicaid, health clinics, welfare (yes I know, but some poverty striken families need food stamps as the jobs go out to India) and all the things that matter most to Americans. So he can pay for this never-ending war.

  94. Good points, Lydia. Bush and his Republican cohorts in the House and Senate are willing to cut billions of dollars from domestic programs in favor of spending billions of dollars in Iraq and elsewhere. Not to mention that hundred of millions, if not billions, of dollars are simply disappearing in Iraq...mostly into thin air...the thin air of Zurich and Geneva and their secretive Swiss bank accounts, that is.

    Meanwhile, Bush talks about making tax cuts permanent when we have a record deficit that he STILL claims will be halved by 2009. Conveniently, he will be out of office in 2009. (Good riddance, by the way)

    So, we may have lower taxes - a few of us, anyway - but we've all seen billions of our hard earned cash get sucked out of our wallets and get deposited as record profits by the oil companies. Exxon Mobil just had a $10+ billion quarter. So, in effect, our tax dollars are now going to the oil companies. How ingenious! I wonder what really took place at those secret energy policy meetings that Cheney chaired back in 2001. You know, the meetings that the oil company CEOs lied to Congress about, saying they didn't attend them when, in fact, they did. And the government still refuses to tell us anything about them. Hmmmmm. Something just a bit fishy about all of this.

    It's all so very sad.

  95. Of course the American people would not sit by while people are beaten in the streets by police officers, arrested and removed from their homes without want or warrant, or be shot by police officers because of their race.

    These are things that happened in Germany, but are not happening here yet right?



    In fact, all of these things I have described have not only repeatedly occurred here in the US, but have occured as recently as within the last week.

    In fact these crimes occur so often lately, that we have dozens of them recorded on video.

    But the people still slumber.

  96. Since 911 our hero worship of the Police has elevated them to a supreme status, that warrants unweilding cooperation and compliance from the citizens, and those who dare to speak out in protest publically, face definate punitive measures.

    Police no longer feel the restraints of reasonable force, or rights of the accused.

    The government meanwhile is busy behind the scenes changing our laws, constitution and taking away rights and freedoms, right under our very noses.

    Don't tell me this is not how Nazi Germany got started. I know a great deal about the little Austrian Corporal. In fact, I would venture to say I am probably the only one in this room who has read his book, My Battle (Mein Kampf).

    Reading Mein Kampf gives one keen insight into the tyrants mind, and the thinking that helps rise great and wicked men to power.

  97. Fear not the enemy from without.

    Fear the enemy within.

  98. Of course Bush could not start arresting people overnight in public.

    It is all done in steps, and while well meaning moderates acquiesce to the twisted cowardly logic of the right, men of iron rule and steel hearts seize the reins of power and drive us all right off the cliff of democracy, into the pit of totalitarianism.

    We know that the best way to fight a cancer, is early detection and prevention.

    Pity we can't utilize the same valuable logic when it comes to detecting the cancer of tyranny in our own country.

  99. The trust that many people seem to place in our political leadership always stuns me just a bit. That just because they are our elected leaders we should trust them implicitly to do the right thing. It's just so naive. And dangerous.

    At a minimum, have we learned nothing from the last 40 years? Gulf of Tonkin, Watergate, Abscam, Iran-Contra, PlameGate, NSA spying, etc. We have EARNED the right to be distrustful of our own government. Is it any wonder that others around the world don't trust our government, either?!!

    We may have learned about the torture prisons and warrantless spying, but how many other secretly lawless activities are taking place right under our noses? And we're now dealing with, inarguably, the most secretive administration EVER.

    Meanwhile, at least 40% of the population that doesn't have a problem with this stuff continues to live in a dreamworld where their leaders are protecting them day and night from the unseen bogeyman. Perhaps that's where Bush got his line in the SOTU address about human-animal hybrids: I believe they're called SHEEPLE!! The Bush base!

  100. SHEEPLE, thats a good one Drewl.

    And you're right.

    We started down the same blood red brick road of facism when we started preaching from the bully pulpit after 911 who was good and who was evil.

    Americans lapped it up hook, line and sinker, and now the rest of the world is left thinking to themselves, perhaps we overestimated the intelligence of the American bumpkins.

    The two dimensional republican bantar, the either for us or against us rants, have done more to endanger the lives, liberty and freedom of every American than any terrorist ever could.

  101. "The government of a nation may be usurped by the forcible intrusion of an individual into the throne.

    But to conquer its will so as to rest the right on that, the only legitimate basis, requires long acquiescence and cessation of all opposition."

    Thomas Jefferson

  102. Drewl,

    You really make a LOT of sense.

    The more I read your posts, the more of myself I see in them.

    Cept of course you're alive and I'm just a ghost. :|

  103. Here sits the Church and here sits the steeple.

    Open it up and theres nothing but SHEEPLE :D

  104. Anonymous2:57 PM

    I agree Worf there are many interesting perspectives and great posts on this board, but yours, Lydia's and Drewl's really stand out in my mind as real thought provoking and interesting posts that always make great points, are clear and concise and really tell it like it is and explain what is really going on.


  105. Lydia

    I watch Keith Oberman's Countdown every night.

    He is a smart, smart cookie. Too smart, which is why he rubs the right so wrong.

    They can't stand a man with an IQ thats higher than a crescent wrench.

  106. And he cracks me up.

    Particularly when he takes Bill AllSmiley out for a ride every night.

    O'reilly's a bully, and Oberman ain't afraid of him one little bit.

    Thats why I like him. He's one of the muscular liberals I am always referring to.


  107. Mike,

    Your 10:40 PM post last night was among the best response posts I've ever read.

    The troll came at you and you handed it right back to him.

    Right in his big fat mouth.

    That was good stuff.

  108. You know I was watching Roman Polanski's Oliver Twist last night, and I mused on the clear liberal and conservative sterotypes played out in the movie, particularly with regards to magistrates and gendarms.

    Its interesting to watch movies these days, as so many seem to draw these distinctions, albeit subtly.

  109. Faigan I think however was a fencesitter. :D

  110. All people, everywhere can basically be drilled down to just 2 catagories.

    1. Those who want the freedom to live and let live.

    2. Those who want the freedom to live and control how everyone else lives too.

    Let each man ask himself; which of these do me and my house endorse?

  111. As for the house of WORFEUS?

    We love the former, and loathe the latter.

  112. Guys.... I guess what I'm asking is this...... Having seen everything that's happened the last few years (and agreeing that in many cases it is inexcusable) does the extreme rhetoric on either side of the argument do anything but continue to polarize the nation? You guys delight in calling these guys Nazis, they enjoy calling you cowards...and so on. And the thing is.... you can have all your facts and opinions correct, but if you start all the "seig heil" talk you turn people off to the whole discussion. And then you lose people who you could possibly educate.......and they turn to their own problems alone -- and vote according to the problems they have (or not at all).

    I hope this makes sense....

    And for the record......

    I love Olbermann...because he cracks me up while making me think

    My copy of Mein Kampf is sitting on my bookcase next to my copy of Maureen Dowd's "Bushworld"...which is next to my copy of "the O'Reilly Factor".... which is next to Al Franken's "Lies, and the lying liars who tell them ...." AND there is a space reserved for "How to talk to Ann Coulter if you must" as well

  113. You're right Kirk, we need to stop all extremist speak on both sides. But what are the 5 stages of grief?

    We are just realizing what this administration has been up to; we were in denial for so long. Now we're in the ANGER stage. We are processing this, and just like the right-wing got really angry at liberal permissiveness and promiscuity back in the Clinton days, that's when Coulter and company formulated their vitriol.

    Actually, I went into the depression stage right after the election and only recently am I fueled by anger. We're human, it's hard to jump straight to love and forgiveness when the other side never admits mistakes or says they're sorry.

    Al Franken is right: Bush is a dry drunk and needs a 12-step program which is where you admit you are not God, admit your mistakes and actually change your selfish behavior. It's a program of learning how to live in the world and care about the effect you have on others.

  114. I hear you Kirk, and I saw a control group on television last night who voiced similar sentiments.

    Problem is I am not trying to make friends, or heal the country. I'm making people think.

    People may not like what I say, but they sure as hell will think about it.

    Are we making the same mistakes that the German people made in the mid 30's?

    Thats a hell of a question.

    And people on the right and in the middle need to start seriously considering this unnerving question.

    We need to stop worrying about how something makes us feel and start learning from the lessons of history.

    Thats how the republicans work. On feelings. Everythings an emotion, a knee jerk reaction, and they shoot from the hip on matters on international security and stability.

    People need to employ logic now more than ever, and stop worrying about getting their feelings hurt buy someones words.

    While we are debating semantics and whether it is socially unacceptable to compare the rise of the Nazi party to occurances in our government today, people are dying.

    And we're the ones killing them and or getting them killed.

    This is not about making me or you feel good, its about stopping the killing of innocent people for our political and financial gain.

    As Lactanticus said almost two thousand years ago, "better to employ words, than blows".

  115. While bringing our people together and all sounds nice, the fact is we have committed international war crimes.

    You may not think so, and half the country may not think so, but most of the world does.

    We need to hold Nuremburg like hearings, investigating the endless allegations of corruption, deception and skullduggery that has been rampant worldwide since little Georgy took the helm following 911.

    If we don't hold our leaders accountable, and demonstrate that the majority of the population knows that torturing defenseless human beings is wrong, regardless of the reasons, and invading countries and butchering thousands of people is wrong, then we are going to find that other nations will hold us accountable, and the mighty US may find itself more alone, and more beseiged, than we ever imagined.

    While little George fiddles, and we debate, the world is watching.

  116. If we don't wake up, were going to find our generation labled as the people who watched as a new tyrant, launched a new Holocaust, this time against the Muslims, and those who look like them.

    Think I'm wrong? Ok.

    I hope to God that I am.

    But you want to bet your legacy on it? You want to bet the world on it?

    You know, thats an awful lot of firepower to be giving a rich boy bumpkin from Crawdad who likes to blow up frogs with firecrackers.

    Think about it.

    Dr StrangeBush, or how I learned to love the bomb.

  117. For ANYONE out there who did not see Robert O'harrow jr, on Jon Stewart tonight, you missed one of the most frightening interviews you will ever see.

    To anyone of you who think the Spying Scandal was blown out of proportion, sit down and put on your seatbelt.

    Everyone of you who buys things with a credit card, a debit card, a check, anyone who surfs the Internet, anyone who makes anytype of electronic transaction, even going through an electronic toll booth, they've got a file on you. A PRO-File to be precise.

    Buy his book, 'No Place to Hide', it looks like a horror classic.

  118. Voltaire8:34 PM

    Watched the SOTU the other night.

    Man Bush ticks me off!

    He refered to Islam as a "Noble Religion" perverted by zealots...
    what a load of garbage.

    We will NEVER defeat terrorism until we realize the truth.

    Christ gave people a reason to live,
    Mohammed gave them a reason to die.
    It's stated purpose is to dominate the world by killing the ifidels (non-believers).

    Mohammed was a murdering, raping, pillaging, pedophile psycho.

    The TERRORISTS are the only ones practicing it correctly. The only people Allah hates worse than Christians and Jews are PEACEFULL MUSLIMS.

    Until we stamp out Islam, terrorism will never, ever, cease. Just watch the news...

    "I am, therefore I am offended"

  119. Worf....when all the Muslims are up in arms over cartoons it makes me a little less sympathetic to what they have to say.

    As we may have discussed some weeks ago you do have to get the splinter out of your eye before removing it from someone else...... but in this case they have a huge log in their eye compared to ours. Yes people have died in our prisons and I'm not proud of it. Things have been covered up and I'm not proud of it. BUT the truth is that these people are worse.... and they show it every day. When they walk into a bar with a bomb strapped to themselves, or behead a journalist or a contractor, they show me that they truly do have a larger splinter in the eye, as it were. Do I think the Repubs have made this worse... absolutely. George Bush is like a fireman who comes into a room and throws GAS on the fire. But in my opinion these people are less enlightened than our right wing (our idiots are more benign than their idiots).

    And again I'm sorry, but this isn't Germany in the 30's..... and it'll be proven to you November when the Dems take back the Congress and start those hearings that we both want.

  120. Voltaire said...

    "Christ gave people a reason to live,
    Mohammed gave them a reason to die."

    "Until we stamp out Islam,
    terrorism will never, ever, cease."

    Thanks buddy.


    I rest my case.

  121. But I'm hoping your right about November.

    Somehow I don't expect these guys are gonna give it up that easy though.

    I have visions of tanks on the White House lawn.

  122. voltaire said;

    "Mohammed was a murdering, raping, pillaging, pedophile psycho"

  123. Yea, I see your point Kirk.

    It's wrong to compare these guys to Nazi's. :|

  124. Voltaire8:52 PM

    Don't start the victory party just yet guys....

    The Republicans MAY lose a few seats in November, but not control of congress. And don't bet on a Dem pres in 08 either...

  125. I'm glad you're here voltaire.

    You offer much illumination on the issues.

  126. Voltaire8:53 PM

    ESPECIALLY if the Dems run Shrillary...

  127. For ANYONE out there who did not see Robert O'harrow jr, on Jon Stewart tonight, you missed one of the most frightening interviews you will ever see.

    To anyone of you who think the Spying Scandal was blown out of proportion, sit down and put on your seatbelt.

    Everyone of you who buys things with a credit card, a debit card, a check, anyone who surfs the Internet, anyone who makes anytype of electronic transaction, even going through an electronic toll booth, they've got a file on you. A PRO-File to be precise.

    Buy his book, 'No Place to Hide', it looks like a horror classic.

  128. Ask not for whom the MaBell tolls, she tolls for thee.

  129. The Dems won't run Hillary in '08. But it would be fun to see a campaign slogan that says "Clinton... bringing back ethics and leadership to the WhiteHouse." Now THAT would be ironic!

    As to Voltaire's comments about the Muslims..... another example of over the top rhetoric. Sounds like the only way to solve the terror problem is to do to the Muslims what our forefathers did to the indians. Send in Colonel Kurtz. I can see it 35 years taking my wife to the Aladdin Casino in Baghdad on our 50th anniversary.

  130. I agree Kirk that the Dems probably won't risk the farm on Hillary in 08. At least I hope they're not that dumb. Who knows, maybe voltaire's right.

    I bet they will go with a safer bet, like O'bama. This would sure up a huge portion if not most of the black vote, and a lot of the liberals will go for him.

    If they had any gnads they'd put out Dean\Hackett in '08 and get this thing done, but one thing I won't bet on is the Dems gnads.

  131. And BTW, don't kid yourself Kirk.

    Voltaire is only expressing what most of the right really feels.

    Bush has already done polling and tested the waters with a war on Muslim "extremeisim" as he calls it, but the fact is we are playing around with the building blocks of an all out Holocaust and most Americans are just too comfortable in their luxurious lives to be concerned.

  132. Call it over the top all you want, but to me, over the top is when a 500lb bomb hits a civilian target, on purpose, because we chose to invade a country for reasons of greed and lust of power, and because they looked like the people who flew the planes into the towers on 911.

    I'll take over the top in words over over the top in deeds, any day.

  133. It's been said the greatest tool the devil has is to convince us he does not exist.

  134. Worf I really like Hackett. I grew up in Cincinnati so I've followed him pretty closely. Hopefully he'll be a senator in a year, so I don't think he'll run for Pres or VP.

    IF Dean runs...he's gotta stay on message and stay away from those manic episodes he's prone to. But I do think he is one who can appeal to the "better angels of our nature", to borrow one from Mr Lincoln.

  135. I agree wholeheartedly on Hackett.

    As for Deans spasms? If you knew the story behind that you may see it quite differntly.

    See Dean was not yelling loud, the crowd was all screeching, hollering and cheering.

    What happened was some sound folks over at Faux news filtered out the crowd and augmented his little hoot so it sounded out of place and awkward.

    Everyone wanted Dean out of the race.

    That hoot is NOTHING compared to the myriad of verbal blunders of our current Steward of the Throne of Gondor.

    Its a RED HERRING to waste time on a little cheer Dean made with thousands of screaming people, while ignoring the fact that this successful govenor and EMERGENCY ROOM SURGEON who dealt with life and death issues every day, has a real message, a coherent message, and the right message.

    The Dems in power don't want him around, so they put him out to pasture as the party chair, then cut him off at the knees everytime theres an opportunity for him to speak.

    Dean\Hackett '08, and you can sign me up.

  136. But keep putting up mealy mouth little whiners like Tim Kaine to respond to the State of the Union, and watch half the left run to Naders open arms.

  137. Oops, did I say that outloud? :o

  138. Dubya says he wants to protect the American people?

    Well Ralph Naders been protecting the American people for 50 years.

    Everytime you security Moms out there buckle up you can thank Mr. Nader, and for a thousand other safeties we now take for granted.

    Lets stop voting for President based on feelings.

    Lets put a minimum IQ of 145 on the table for the President, and anything under doesn't even get to run.

    Instead of having Presidents who are members of the secretive Skull & Bones Society, lets have Presidents who are members of Mensa!

    The 21st Century is gonna be the Century of the leaders with the big fat brains, and those without an 150 IQ need not apply.

  139. "The biggest cause of trouble in the world today is that the stupid people are so sure about things and the intelligent folks are so full of doubts."

    Bertrand Russell

  140. Anonymous9:55 PM

    Kirk you do raise a valid point that we should seek to educate people rather than turn them off, and I will make an effort to be a little more mindful of what I say, now having said that i'm not going to walk on egg shells and not speak my mind either, i'm not spewing party rhetoric, I dont even belong to a party, I will say that I have always leaned to the left and towards the democrats, but i'm not a registered democrat, and in fact in 2000 I voted for Nader (which I regret because I think people doing that may have helped Bush get in).I'm not any kind of political activist in fact I never really even thought about politics until 9/11 but around that time I saw a lot of disturbing things our government was doing and I started questioning them. When I see a change and or new leadership not taking us in what I feel is an evil and wrong direction then i'll stop speaking out.

    When I make comparisons to the Nazi's seizing power in Germany thats not Hard core fringe Left Wing Rhetoric, thats what i truly believe, when I see Bush and Cheney I see Nazi's.Look at the previous post, he's advocating exterminating ALL Muslims, Bush had a woman whose son died fighting for our country arrested a few nights ago, you can say she was released after a few hours all you want but this guy abused his power and made a mockery of the constitution and our laws all to intimidate a USA citizen and take away her rights because he feels he is omnipotent and no one should dare question him.These guys are trying to surpress all points of views but their own, look at how they hung up the phone on Lydia last night I can guarenty they wouldnt have done that if the caller was saying what they wanted to hear. The right always use to claim the media was controlled by the Liberals, there has clearly been a huge shift and the right is controlling the media and thus our access to information which means we now have to seriously question and consider the validity of information we receive as well as information that might be surpressed or filtered to suit an agenda. One of the most interesting classes I took in College was a class called "Power and Influenence" we studied how people seize or acquire power, we studied Hitler's rise to power, as well as various government coups and cover ups and various movies and the tactics, methods and progressive steps for seizing power are always the same, they've been classic throughout history and i'm seeing them right now. But if I had to list the most important thing I learned in college its to question the source and reliability of the information received, one of the first thing that happens in a power grab is the government seizes control of the press, then information is either surpressed or filtered according to the governments agenda and people are easily misled and deceived.

    If you do see this as rhetoric, then i ask whose rhetoric is more credible, the side that labels dissenters as unpatriotic and supporting or in league with the terrorists (think how uterly riddiculous that sounds)they also are changing the constitution to take away our rights look at Sheehan being arrested and the spying thing, these are clear assaults on the the 1st and 4th amendments, not to mention the misimformation and lies they used to go to war, and again any dissenters were silenced, The United Nations and most of Europe were marginalized and riddiculed by the right wing.

    While the so called rhetoric from the left is not to trust our government because they are attempting a power grab like the nazi's did, look at the facts and you tell me which argument is more credible. while it might be difficult or even seem riddiculous to compare our country to nazi germany, we need to ask hard and controverial questions and point out what is going on as Worfeus said to get people thinking, if they dont like it, they may not like what happens if we turn a blind eye even less.

    "All evil needs to prosper is for good men to do nothing"

  141. This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.

  142. Very well said "anonymous" or was that you Mike?

  143. But Kirk, don't feel opposed.

    I understand your point. I just want you to understand that I am not some longhaired freak buring flags and ranting conspiracy theories.

    I am like Mike I guess, not really politcally active until Bush took over.

    And when we get back to our usual minor corruption scandals and such, I'll go back to being the spoiled greedy capitialist that I am, and you won't here another peep out of me as I help the money machine move the world ahead.

    I believe in the end, invetion, creation, industry and growth, all checked with sound reason and equity, will be what saves us all. It saved us in WW2. It wasn't just soldiers courage that saved us all, it was our industry and technology and that American can do capability that saved the world.

    When everyone has enough to eat, and a decent place to sleep, then there will be no war.

  144. Voltaire10:06 PM

    Tabari IX:69 “Killing disbelievers is a small matter to us.”

    Ishaq:369 “Thereupon Mas’ud leapt upon Sunayna, one of the Jewish merchants with whom his family had social and commercial relations and killed him. The Muslim’s brother complained, saying, ‘Why did you kill him? You have much fat in you belly from his charity.’ Mas’ud answered, ‘By Allah, had Muhammad ordered me to murder you, my brother, I would have cut off your head.’ Wherein the brother said, ‘Any religion that can bring you to this is indeed wonderful!’ And he accepted Islam.”

    Bukhari:V1B11N626 “The Prophet said, ‘No prayer is harder for the hypocrites than the Fajr. If they knew the reward they would come to (the mosque) even if they had to crawl. I decided to order a man to lead the prayer and then take a flame to burn all those who had not left their houses for the prayer, burning them alive inside their homes.’”

    Qur’an 9:5 “When the sacred forbidden months for fighting are past, fight and kill the disbelievers wherever you find them, take them captive, torture them, and lie in wait and ambush them using every stratagem of war.”

    Qur’an 9:3 “Allah is not bound by any contract or treaty with non-Muslims, nor is His Apostle.”

  145. Kirk said "And again I'm sorry, but this isn't Germany in the 30's..... and it'll be proven to you November when the Dems take back the Congress and start those hearings that we both want. "

    8:37 PM

    I hope your right

  146. Yes, we get it voltaire.

    You want to kill Muslims.

    We got it.

  147. Voltaire10:11 PM

    Ghost of Worfeus said...

    "Yes, we get it voltaire.
    You want to kill Muslims.
    We got it."

    No, you don't get it. THEY want to kill US.

    We need to kill their leaders and convert them to Christianity...

  148. Worfeus said"It's been said the greatest tool the devil has is to convince us he does not exist."

    9:21 PM

    Thats a good quote

  149. I'm watching the History channel right now, and they are talking about the rise of Hitler.

    They said he presented himself to the people as a man of the people. One of them.

    He used their anger and frustration, and the threat of perpetual war, and unseen enemies to change the laws and take away freedoms, and single out certain races for police scrutiny and arrest.

  150. So according to you we need to take this a step farther and make it a so called "holy War" like the terrorists call it, why dont we change the rhetoric too while we are at it, instead of the "War on Terror" we can call it the "Crusades Part 2"

  151. Exactly, thats what i've been saying, the tactics for a power grab are timeless and if done skillfully and subtly the masses arent even aware till its too late, like Lydia said "the frog wont jump out of the pan if you turn the heat up slowly"

  152. Voltaire10:24 PM

    No Mike, I'm just kidding...

    Just because they're religeous zealots and their religion and schools and media tells them to kill us doesn't mean they ACTUALLY will...

    All those Imam's and rioters chanting "Death to America" is satire, Suicide bombers in Israel and elsewhere are just staging a parody. Just for laughs...

    Gosh can't you infidels take a joke?
    Heck we even offered a truce!
    (...uh, forget that part in the Koran about not honoring a treaty or contract with non-believers...Allah was just joking around)

  153. Worf one thing I've learned thus far is to have no preconceived notions about anyone or anything. The thing to do now, IMO is to be pragmatic and realize that the only way to change things is at the ballot box...... hell thats what the Moral Majority has finally done. It took 'em longer than they thought because they thought Bush I was their guy like Reagan was, but now they've got the Supreme Court for the next 50 years ( a pragmatic move right now would be to realize Roe V Wade is gone, and to push HARD for the release of the morning after pill over the counter w/o prescription), and we're just 5+ years into the "New American Century". Grassroots organization is the only way the Dems are going to take back congress and the WH.... and if your local party orginization won't do it then light a fire under 'em.

    Sorry's after 11:30 CST and Ive got an 8 year old with the runs....... catch up with ya in the AM

    (war is ) peace

  154. I just urned on the history channel too


  155. "Dort, wo man Bücher verbrennt, verbrennt man am Ende auch Menschen.”

  156. Voltaire10:30 PM

    And remember IRAQ didn't start it, it started a long time ago...

    Carter ignored it,
    Reagan ignored it,
    Daddy Bush ignored it,
    and Clinton ignored it.

    GW is trying but he doesn't understand the EXTENT of it, and I'm not sure any in government right now would ADMIT it even if they DO understand it.


  157. "Dort, wo man Bücher verbrennt, verbrennt man am Ende auch Menschen.”

    "Where they have burned books, they will end in burning men"

    Heinrich Heine

  158. War breeds war.

    If your so scared of Islamic terrorists voltaire, why don't you go buy one of those steel panic rooms, crawl in and lock the door, and well call you when it's safe to come out.

  159. You gotta die sometime buddy.

    Might as well live free, and do as little harm as possible along the way.

    We all will die. We can't control that.

    But we can control how we live.

  160. Along the lines of the frog in the frying pan example, don't be surprised if the Bush administration is employing a strategy that takes certain tactics into an "overboard" state, only to scale them back to less extreme levels that are accepted by the public.

    For example, gas prices. Shoot 'em up to $3+ per gallon, absorb the outrage, then scale them back to $2.50. The outrage is tempered and people become accustomed to the $2.50 price.

    Another example, surveillance. Did anyone know a bloody thing about FISA before December? Some, maybe. But not most people. Push the envelope by supposedly authorizing warrantless spying - i.e. going overboard - then scale it back to get acceptance of the less onerous warranted spying.

    Another example, torture. Go to the extreme with administration desires for torture and secret prisons, then scale it back to a more acceptable level.

    Over time, our outrage becomes tempered by things that are less objectionable than the extremes. And, over time, the envelope can be pressed further and further.

    Not saying this is absolutely a planned approach, but I could see some validity in it. It also might explain why some think the White House itself disclosed the warrantless spying program in order to get more people on board with the less onerous Patriot Act provisions.

    Food for thought...

  161. I don't think it will be long before Republicans start wearing armbands to tell them apart from democrats on the street.

    Maybe they will start banning liberal businesses and such, like they did the Dixie Chicks.

    Wonder what color those armbands would be?

    What color identifies the right states again?

    Oh yea, Red.

  162. As usual good points drewl, what you say makes lot of sense

  163. I was kidding there BTW.

    At least I think I was :o

  164. What Drewl calls food for thought, sends chills down my spine.

    Drewl is a smart, smart man.

    And his last post was what so many of us have been feeling for years now.

  165. Voltaire Said"And remember IRAQ didn't start it, it started a long time ago..."

    Please dont insult my intelligence by spewing your Right Wing rhetoric attempting to link Iraq to the terrorists, we should have been using ALL of our resources to capture and kill OSAMA and the real terrorists in Afghanistan not fighting Bush's war in Iraq, we've stirred up a hornets nest in Iraq, they dont want us occupying their land and we are actually stirring up hatred of America and helping them recruit regular Muslims to the cause by being there. There was no link between Iraq and Al Queda only the lies implied by the Bush Administration who are using this war to as their rallying cry to seize power and profit from the war. and dont talk down to me like your some kind of intellectual whose much smarter than me when all you are is a Riight Wing Troll advocating hate and genocide, terrorists are one thing but how can any one take someone seriously that advocates exterminating the whole Muslim race and starting the crusades all mover again.

  166. Mankind has grown great in eternal struggle and only in eternal peace does it perish. The stronger must dominate, and not blend with the weaker, thus sacrificing his own greatness.

    Those who want to live, let them fight; and those who do not want to fight, in this world of eternal stuggle, do not deseve to live.

    Never yet has a state been founded by peaceful economic means. Only terror is capable of smashing terror.

    Adolph Hitler

  167. I get the feeling though, that a bunch of cartoons have stirred up muslim hatred of the west more than the invasion of Iraq has. I wonder when the first bomber will strike Denmark?

  168. Voltaire said "No Mike, I'm just kidding...
    Just because they're religeous zealots and their religion and schools and media tells them to kill us doesn't mean they ACTUALLY will...

    Then Voltaire also said"We need to kill their leaders and convert them to Christianity... "

    Doesnt the Right wing ever get any new material they insult people and advocate killing and genocide then hide like a bunch of cowards and say "i'm only joking" when they get called on something, and now someone is even making a case for starting the crusades part two, yeah we kill their leaders then tell them to convert to Christianity or we exterminate them, and we wonder why more and more regular main stream Muslims are being recruited by the terrorists and why they hate us, who are we to decide what religion people must believe in and what right do we have to issue an ultimatum like "convert to Christianity or Die". Ignorant hate speak like this is what is turning the world against us and helping the terrorists to recruit.

  169. I think Voltaire may have been talking about more than 9/11. As far as war between muslims and the US started in like 1800 with the Barbary Corsairs....... "to the shores of Tripoli" refers to this, as I recall.

  170. " We need to kill their leaders and convert them to Christianity"

    Thank you Rev Falwell for your wonderfully enlightened commentary. Anytime the idea even pops in to my head that I should vote (r) I just have to remember sayings like this and others to bring me back to sanity.

    At the same time....guys there is a lot of ignorant hate-speak coming out of the muslim world right now in regards to free speech. And honestly Voltaire is right in that as far as priorities go..... I want to stop the idiots who will behead my son before I want to stop the ones who arrested Cindy Sheehan.

  171. Regardless of when it started, to say they should convert to Christianity or die, thats pretty out there. Now lets not forget that we are in their country, killing people they are not in ours and regular civilians are dying as well as terrorists. I think we should be going after the real terrorists, not sacrificing our soldier in Iraq for who knows what the real reason is, for a people that dont even want us there.

  172. No argument there, we should be going after the real terrorists, but we have to be mindful to not help there cause by making it easier for them to recruit more.

  173. And I'd prefer not to convert them to Christianity...... I'd rather they become zen buddhists and follow the Dalai Lama. I'd rather we all become zen buddhists come to think of it.

  174. Mike you get no argument from me on the fact we shouldn't be in Iraq.... It's been 4+ years since 9/11 and we can't find a 6'5" 155lb. towelhead on dialysis hiding in a mountain....... is this guy Dr. Evil or something?

    But if we had all 130000 or whatever troops in Afghanistan/Pakistan right now we'd have the same insurgency there as well. Jill Carroll would still be captured, and Iran would still be moving toward nukes (thats NEW CUE LUR for you republicans)

  175. By the way I just have to add that I'm so glad to find out that the President has back tracked and I'm not addicted to oil after all!

    The last thing I need is another bunch of 12 step meetings sitting around saying "My name is Kirk, and I'm an oil addict", and that I'm powerless over my addiction to oil...and how I went to Alaska after the Valdez sank and actually licked up the oil off the shore.

    And then having my wife and kids have to go to "oil-anon" meetings as well. Boy am I glad that's settled once and for all!

  176. Voltaire10:51 AM

    Well lets see...

    THEIR "religion" tells THEM to KILL Christians, Jews and all infidels until Islam is the ONLY religion.

    I say, "Right back atcha!"

    You guys have a bowel movement everytime Falwell or Robertson burps up something stupid and curse "religeous extremists".

    Well here's some religeous extremists you can REALLY go after.

    These guys KILL, or want to kill everyone who doesn't agree with them.

    Oh wait, I forgot. Islam is the "religion of peace". Silly me, BUSH is the extremist...

  177. Voltaire's right about this in some ways. Like I said...we've pissed as many off over cartoons than we have over invading Iraq. The "west" has that is. These people really are showing how wacko they are. The fatwa ordering the death of all cartoonists and their editors is coming soon.

    But I do think a blanket statment about all of Islam is erroneous. I know too many who are no different than me. I'm curious as to how many Voltaire knows?

  178. See clearly how the right has deluded itself people?

    Wannabe smart guys like voltaire, who openly condemn the Muslim religion as evil and needing to be desroyed, it obviously ignorant of the horrible and wicked crimes committed by the Mother Christian Church for the past 2000 years. Since its earliest times Christians were persecuting those who did not bow to their almighty will.

    Torture, murder, rape, seizing of homes and property and a myriad of other henious crimes saturate the existence of the first Christian Church.

    As early as 350 CE we know the Church was torturing those who dared to speak out or defy their will. We know hundreds of thousands were butchered for failing to adequately convert to the peaceful Christian religion.

    And now the current motto of the Catholic Church has been changed from feeding the Children to fu@#&@#ing the Children.

    You guys have been raping, torturing and butchering human beings in the name of Christ for 2000 years there slappy.

    So before you go pulling the mote out of your brothers eye, you might want to inspect that big fat railroad tie in your own.

  179. Peter the Hermit, Walter the Penniless, Godfrey of Bouillon, Eustace of Flanders, all great Christians who rode off to to the Holy Land to slaughter Muslims who had never raised a hand in anger against them.

    Now we can add George "Dubya" Bush to the list.

  180. I take that back.

    Actually Bush is more like Urban II, who sent his Crusaders off to slay the filthy heathen.

    All hail Pope URBUSH II.

  181. Christians have been invading Muslim Holy land for over a 1000 years.

    For the most part unsuccessfully I might add.

  182. Hey I know, I got an idea.

    Why don't we try NOT invading their holy land for the next 1000 years?


    I mean, since the other shtick didn't work, maybe we could give this idea a go?

    Because your current plan has been an absolute train wreck.

  183. Anonymous12:46 PM

    I have no problem at all going after The REAL Terrorist Religious Extremists, but saying we should exterminate all muslim's if they refuse to convert to Christianity is insane. think how riddiculous that sounds, and you want people to take you seriously after a statement like that. How different is that from what Hitler said (he believed he had good reasons for exterminating people as well) and like Worfeus said this will result in a disaster for us as well.


  184. Like I said .......convert everyone to Zen Buddhism. Beats Christianity and Islam any day. Although the Dalai Lama would not convert via the sword.....Jesus wouldn't either ( his followers sure have a problem with it though)...... but Muhammad.... now there's another story altogether.

    Like I said before..... priorities. I want to get rid of the guys who wanna behead my son (and there are ALOT of 'em) before I want to get rid of the ones who arrested Cindy Sheehan. And I want to get rid of the latter via the ballot box..... the former... I hate to say it, but by any means necessary...militaristic or diplomatic.

  185. As far as history goes..... Charles Martel won the Battle of Tours in 732..... thus stopping moslem expansion into Europe. The first Crusade was in 1095, and it was in response to moslem turks attacking Christians headed to the holy land......... so my point is that it's not just a history of "Christian invasion" that's the problem.

  186. Worf Said: "Why don't we try NOT invading their holy land for the next 1000 years?


    THe petty (R) answer to this is simple.........because it was our holy land first (Israel anyway)

    The real answer is simple..... OIL. The strength of our dollar is based on oil. It is in the best interest of the US economy that we control this oil (I'm not sayin its moral.... I'm just saying it is.) THats why we're gonna do something @ Iran as well..... we cant have them selling their oil for euros because that weakens the dollar.

  187. Anonymous1:21 PM

    Great post Kirk, your absolutely right.


  188. Kirk said;

    I want to get rid of the guys who wanna behead my son (and there are ALOT of 'em) before I want to get rid of the ones who arrested Cindy Sheehan

    Problem with that plan is it wont work.

    How many Americans are dying from terrorists in the US these days?

    How about for the last 10 years?

    How about the last 20?

    The facts are that terrorists are the LEAST of our worries. You have a better chance of having a vending machine fall on you and kill you than you do of being killed by a terrorist.

    And in truth, the terrorists would not even be an issue if we would leave Muslim holy land alone.

    The real threat to America, the threat that can do the most harm, is not the evil without, but the evil within.


    Ever. We are anglo saxons. The land belonged to the Sons of Abraham, both Muslim and Jew.

    Not us.




  190. Anonymous1:25 PM

    I also agree with what you said about doing what ever is necessary to get rid of the extremist beheading people and blowing people up, but saying we should exterminate all Muslims is something altogether different. we need to be seriously afraid of this type of narrow minded thinking, because it will lead us to bad place.


  191. Anonymous1:27 PM

    Worfs right, If we would leave their land, I dont think we would have much to fear at home, we are creating many of these problems by occupying their land.


  192. Kirk,

    I have a lot of respect for you, and I think you are a smart man, but I suspect you have been hoodwinked with the rest of America into believing that these people live to kill us.

    We started this war.

    We started over a 1000 years ago, and we have not quit yet.

    Were like the kid who throws rocks at a hornets nest, then when he gets stung about a dozen times, decides hornets are bad and spends the rest of his life spraying hornets nests with pesticides.

    I live on a small ranch. I have barns and old buildings, with dozens of hornets nests, blackjackets, bumbly bees, etc.

    And I have not been stung once.

    Wanna know why?

    Cause I leave them the hell alone.

    Thats why.

  193. Worf I live on a farm too.... so I'm with you on that. Ive never been stung (or bitten by a snake for that matter) BUT I have had my dogs sprayed by a skunk, and that really sucks!!!!!

    As to my being hoodwinked.... I don't know. Convince me that Muhammad was not a warrior. He had more kills than most modern day warriors from what I've read. And that moslem expansion into europe wasn't stopped at Tours in 732 (270 years before the first crusade).

    But like I said... I reject the notion that the solution to this is some Crusade to convert all of them. That's just nonsense. But you gotta admit they're more like Sonny Corleone than they are like Micheal. Or Fredo (of course Fredo is more like GW Bush!!)

  194. And honestly Worf I think our history discussion over the last millennium is moot. Didn't all this really heat up @1947 or so when a certain "chosen people" were allowed to go back to their "promised land" because the west felt so bad @ the "final solution" that the Nazi's had imposed.


    And I have not been stung once.

    Wanna know why?

    Cause I leave them the hell alone.

    This is the great metaphysical secret of Christ's teaching, Buddha's teaching, all the great wisdom. try it on some small problem in your life, it ALWAYS works.

  196. I understand the analogy about getting stung.... but you guys have to understand that the moslem religion came out of the gate swinging.

    So when the hornets nest is on my porch then I have to takesome kind of action, yes?